What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram • Hacker News Board

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#51

Post by kybernetyk » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:27 AM UTC

omegant wrote: post #37

brazzy wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget the other side of the coin: that "can do attitude" and that environment can also, if you buy into it too far and don't get lucky, have you broke and homeless. It's partially a gamble, and magazines write articles only about the winners.

I agree with that, but that´s true anywhere in the world. In Spain if your company fails you may be personally liable of the debt. Recently a bank removed 3000€ from my grandmother account because of a debt dated from 1993 of my deceased grandfather´s company. My grandmother is 97 years old, and the funniest part is that debt was settled long ago. Also if you fail nobody is going to trust in you any more, you are don…

> Also if you fail nobody is going to trust in you any more, you are done.

It's the same in Germany. If you fail with a business you are on the same level of a criminal to many people. I don't care about being jobless (because I know how to scrub together at least 1000 Euros every month). But the "failed business" stigma is really what inhibits entrepreneurship here.

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#52

Post by logicallee » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:28 AM UTC

dasil003 wrote: post #46

logicallee wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The portion you refer to is pocket change. Read http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2127882/Meet-OTHER-n... . and it becomes clear that the 18 employees were recruited mostly with equity. Hiring the quality of talent that we're talking about, in will1000's market, just doesn't happen with the kind of equity (e.g. 10% pool) that instagram was using - outside of silicon valley that is.

There is no mention of salaries in that article. It seems like you are a little bit jealous and rampantly speculating about this whole scenario. Obviously with the trajectory Instagram was on it was much easier to hire with equity. I don't know what you mean about the "level of talent" though. There are hundreds of small teams with the talent level of Instagram both in and out of the valley, but talent does not guara…

I'm not jealous at all. Talent is one thing, but do you honestly think you can have a professional team working on the payroll that (I assume) Instagram had?

I just don't see it happening. one thing is you are right, I don't have detailed payroll figures. I was going on the prevailing wind and the fact that the employees were 20-somethigns.

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#53

Post by logicallee » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:30 AM UTC

dasil003 wrote: post #48

logicallee wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a bit confused, we might have misunderstood each other. There's nothing to "back up" - I said that the most talented employees in the world, who can build a $1B company up in 18 months, will not do so outside Silicon Valley in exchange for a 10% employee equity pool, and a low base salary. Outside Silicon Valley they would only do so for a very high base salary.

Are you a foreign national who can't move to the valley? Because you certainly have an extremely distorted view of reality. People are not being hired with pure equity with the ease you seem to think. Also, I might add as the co-founder of a growing startup with offices in both Palo Alto and London, salaries are higher and competition for employees stiffer in the valley.

Let me put it to you this way. Can you hire a talented CEO in London within the next month, who will work for you for below half the median wage in London and be able to build a company with you and a cofounder that is worth $10M within a year?

In the valley, this is easy. You do have to give up equity though.

In London, the above will get you shown the door, with a grin. Haha, good luck.

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#54

Post by logicallee » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:31 AM UTC

kybernetyk wrote: post #47

logicallee wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The portion you refer to is pocket change. Read http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2127882/Meet-OTHER-n... . and it becomes clear that the 18 employees were recruited mostly with equity. Hiring the quality of talent that we're talking about, in will1000's market, just doesn't happen with the kind of equity (e.g. 10% pool) that instagram was using - outside of silicon valley that is.

It would be interesting to know how they pitched the jobs to their future employees? If someone came to me saying "Hey dude, work for free and you get 5% stake in a photo sharing app for the iPhone. It's cool app. We have filters!" I'd show him the door. So there must have been some "we know people at $comp and they will buy us out"-talk to convince people to work for free.

I'd be interested in knowing where you're located. Not quite for "free" but including a very low salary what you've just derided seems like a fairly standard startup pitch...

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#55

Post by Kiro » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:42 AM UTC

SandB0x wrote: post #31

You may as well be reading about a rock band here. This story does not and will not apply to you. This is the one in a thousand/million fairy-tale of the frivolous app dreamed up in coffee shops, fuelled by rapid investment and sold for vast sums to a tech giant without so much as a whiff of a business model.

What's with the negativity? Are you telling inspiring musicians to stop trying as well?

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#56

Post by pathy » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:43 AM UTC

mailshanx wrote: post #24

pathy wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess would be that it is harder, especially to get connections like Zuckerberg, if nothing else because he, and others like him, are now quite hard to reach. That said, getting to know the up-and-coming Valley entrepreneurs should be doable. It is not as easy as getting to know them while you are in college but go to conventions, go to coffee shops, bars. If that is not your thing, start conversations on HN, Twit…

But doesn't a huge part of the problem stem from geography? Like you, i'm finishing up my Masters in Singapore - that is pretty much on the opposite side of the globe as SV. Surely i can't afford to go flying around to SV conferences as a student. I'll be speaking at a few conferences in Europe this summer, but still, i feel that if you are not located at least in the USA, you are missing out on a huge piece of start…

That is very true, it is unrealistic for us to travel to SV to just socialize. Speaking at conferences seems like a great way to build a reputation and get to meet people. If only I had something to speak about that would interest people... :)

We do miss out a lot of startup action but there are still large startups in Europe, and I assume Singapore. I do think making connections via HN/Twitter etc can mitigate some of the issues caused by geography but not entirely.

Talking to people in your industry (especially if your speciality is quite niche) goes a fairly long way. Perhaps someone in your niche went to your alma mater, or lived in Singapore - that is something in common that can spark a conversation.

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#57

Post by nhangen » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:48 AM UTC

Skibb wrote: post #38

Ugh this is linkbait and upvote-bait if I ever saw one. The whole tone of the article is so contrived and fake-mysterious that it's kind of digusting. Basically the whole thing can be tracked down to a rich privileged white kid doing what rich privileged kids do. NOTHING worth reading about here. And the shitty app could maybe start about thinking of getting some cash flow.

What does being white have to do with it?

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#58

Post by corford » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:49 AM UTC

replicatorblog wrote: post #41

corford wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading between the lines, it seems the major contributing factors to their success were the connections they had to other ex-Stanford alumni (Zuckerberg himself being one of them), the internship at Twitter and the stint at Google. A more interesting question (at least for me) is: Would Instagram's success have been possible (or that fast) if the founders had not gone to Stanford?

Zuckerberg is a gentleman of Harvard! I say good day!

Ha good point! I always forget he didn't attend Stanford.

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#59

Post by Jare » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:54 AM UTC

SandB0x wrote: post #31

You may as well be reading about a rock band here. This story does not and will not apply to you. This is the one in a thousand/million fairy-tale of the frivolous app dreamed up in coffee shops, fuelled by rapid investment and sold for vast sums to a tech giant without so much as a whiff of a business model.

The name of the publication is "Vanity Fair".

Re: What Really Happened When Facebook Bought Instagram

#60

Post by SandB0x » Mon, May 06, 2013, 10:57 AM UTC

Kiro wrote: post #55

SandB0x wrote: post #31

You may as well be reading about a rock band here. This story does not and will not apply to you. This is the one in a thousand/million fairy-tale of the frivolous app dreamed up in coffee shops, fuelled by rapid investment and sold for vast sums to a tech giant without so much as a whiff of a business model.

What's with the negativity? Are you telling inspiring musicians to stop trying as well?

Aspiring musicians appreciate the vast odds against them becoming the Next Big Thing. It takes an extremely young or naive person to believe that they will become a wild success off the back of some unpaid gigs or their YouTube channel.

In fact, most musicians that I know are rightly insistent on being paid for their performances and are suspicious of promoters and agents who are eager for them to gain exposure by playing for free.

Edit: Essentially there is a continuum of risk/reward between

* Consulting or creating a small and stable business (or, say, playing as a session musician)

* Buying lottery tickets.

I just don't think that people are always aware of where they are on that scale and it doesn't seem right to give people false impressions of where they and their ideas stand. Yeah I do sound like a grumpy sod :)