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Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
51–60 of 60 posts
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#52I've said it before and I'll say it again: anonymity online and encrypted communications are one of the most important problems we're going to going to face in the coming decades. Hackers should be working on those, not clever ways to serve ads or geolocating your latest locally-sourced coffee. If you don't believe the US is already permanently archiving vast swaths of communication, it's not a big leap of imaginatio…
> Or it doesn't even have to go that far; some government spokesperson lets your name slip in an interview as a "suspect" and the media attention you'll get will forever ruin your life even if the government does nothing. Unless the government gets out of the business of handling birth certificates, driver's licenses, etc. they're simply going to have your name. Secure communications channels is certainly an importan…
It wasn't too long ago that the US had the HUAC committee, and ruined many people's reputations by digging up what they'd said in the past.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Or it doesn't even have to go that far; some government spokesperson lets your name slip in an interview as a "suspect" and the media attention you'll get will forever ruin your life even if the government does nothing. Unless the government gets out of the business of handling birth certificates, driver's licenses, etc. they're simply going to have your name. Secure communications channels is certainly an importan…
It wasn't too long ago that the US had the HUAC committee, and ruined many people's reputations by digging up what they'd said in the past.
Using something said in the past to embarrass in the present is one thing. It is often justified, like with "mission accomplished" or the "the fundamentals of the economy are strong."
Prosecuting for something that was legally done in the past is a whole different issue.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
It wasn't too long ago that the US had the HUAC committee, and ruined many people's reputations by digging up what they'd said in the past.
Using something said in the past to embarrass in the present is one thing. It is often justified, like with "mission accomplished" or the "the fundamentals of the economy are strong." Prosecuting for something that was legally done in the past is a whole different issue.
Government sponsored embarrassment isn't the same as putting someone in jail, you are right.
However, taking away someone's ability to make a living (see the Hollywood blacklist, etc.) is leverage that can be used to control behavior. The HUAC hearings were a big bad thing that was done. It wasn't as bad as slavery, for example, but it is something that happened very recently and I think we want to avoid.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#55If it is happening, it might some day be culturally accepted. There are steps after that. Are you allowed access to your own history? One big business aspect of gmail is that - easy searchability of your whole email history.
It will contain stuff written by other people as well. Will there be some policy of email expiration?
In the end we get to something like in science fiction. Hannu Rajaniemi's Quantum Thief has externalized common memory and also your private memories that can be recovered. Also pieces of them that can be shared directly. Such centralized systems have a whole host of new security problems.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
But the thing is that this power of which you speak is supposed to be ours, per our form of government. We are so far off the reservation that we have given up on trying to reclaim our government and instead, must now find ways to protect ourselves from our government. That's a powerful statement about the plight of our nation.
Trouble is, the government represents 300 million people. You can't "reclaim your government" when the angered party consists of a couple thousand people.
I'm not sure what you mean by "the angered party", but my point was specifically that our government has been co-opted by interest groups that are not the people.
The fact that we have 300 million citizens and majority will cannot be expressed is exactly a symptom of this condition. The government is no longer the people, but a separate entity with its own agendas. Agendas which frequently run counter to the interests of the people.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Or it doesn't even have to go that far; some government spokesperson lets your name slip in an interview as a "suspect" and the media attention you'll get will forever ruin your life even if the government does nothing. Unless the government gets out of the business of handling birth certificates, driver's licenses, etc. they're simply going to have your name. Secure communications channels is certainly an importan…
It wasn't too long ago that the US had the HUAC committee, and ruined many people's reputations by digging up what they'd said in the past.
I'm not saying you should not watch what the government knows about you. It is that you should also watch what everyone else knows about you.
I always get confused in these threads because I cannot separate those who are worried about the privacy of their data from those who simply hate the government (or even the idea of government).
If you're trying to deploy a cryptosystem that relies on popularity to be really useful, then you'll need to get "average Joe" to buy into it, and I suspect the best way to do that is to point out all of the possible Big Brothers out there, not just rabble-rabble about the gubbmint alone.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#58My recollection of the NSA's legal interpretation is that they feel they don't need a warrant to record everyone's traffic; they only need a warrant for a human to subsequently access those recordings. The twist this puts on "having nothing to hide" is that it means you have to trust everything you say now will forever be considered benign, rather than just at this particular moment in history. Open Whisper Systems i…
It's not a completely ridiculous legal interpretation. The 4th amendment is implemented via the exclusionary rule, which excludes evidence from a court case obtained from an unreasonable search. As a matter of history and practice (the exclusionary rule predates the Constitution), the 4th amendment is in many ways a rule governing criminal procedure more than it is a privacy rule per se. Now, today the prevailing vie…
It is ridiculous because the 4th AM was used to legalize abortion. So in point of fact, there is nothing that is not ridiculous about the entire thing.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
Being pissed leads to me donating money to the ACLU, voting, and voicing my opinions.
One of those might do something.
It's asinine to suggest that we remove vocal outrage from our political dialog. It is one of the finest tools of change. Just look at all the faux outrage over "high unemployment" under Bush 43 (average of around 5%), and compare it to the lack of outrage in today's economy. No, I think outrage is not something I'll give up to please supposedly enlightened people like yourself.
Re: Are all telephone calls recorded and accessible to the US government?
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
Using something said in the past to embarrass in the present is one thing. It is often justified, like with "mission accomplished" or the "the fundamentals of the economy are strong." Prosecuting for something that was legally done in the past is a whole different issue.
Government sponsored embarrassment isn't the same as putting someone in jail, you are right. However, taking away someone's ability to make a living (see the Hollywood blacklist, etc.) is leverage that can be used to control behavior. The HUAC hearings were a big bad thing that was done. It wasn't as bad as slavery, for example, but it is something that happened very recently and I think we want to avoid.
/nod