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A Proposal: Renaming Backend/Frontend to Application/UI Developers

theothersideofcode.com

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Re: A Proposal: Renaming Backend/Frontend to Application/UI Developers

#14

Post by k__ »

zappan wrote: post #6
dutchbrit wrote: post #3

I hate titles, sure, it does look more fancy. Besides, you can have frontend only applications written in javascript. Would that make me just a 'UI Developer'? I can go on and on, but just stick with a title that explains your skills the best. I can't stick a label on myself. I dabble in a lot of fields. I don't disagree with all of your points however. People should just make up their own title that fit them best.

I'm afraid you're missing it a bit - just making only javascript applications is the reason to make a different distinction - some people are better at doing MVC, and they do it in the browser now; while some people are great in making great looking UIs, but not really digging into application architecture. And, of course, there are people doing both, being full-stack devs, but still they're usually more efficient in…

I'm an UI-developer, but I still have to think about software architecture, because we have a multi-tier System.

There is a data-gathering (tier-1) and -mutation (tier-2) backend and a HTTP-front-end to gather this data (tier-3).

And then there is the GUI (tier-4), which is an application itself, with the HTTP-frontend as backend.

The back-end developers work in tier-1/2 The front-end evelopers work in tier-3/4

Re: A Proposal: Renaming Backend/Frontend to Application/UI Developers

#16

Post by michaelochurch »

Zed Shaw already solved this problem: http://programming-motherfucker.com .

What made programming great (before the Douchebag Invasion came in and we were divided into these stupid warring camps) is now what makes "data science" attractive: the generalist flair and the ability to pick your projects and move around the economy by your own sail.

By the way, I personally hate the term "software engineer", at least as commonly used. It sounds Corporate and I feel like I need a shower after I say it. Genuine software engineering (like, what people who build rockets do, where attention to code quality is critical and people actually consider proving code) is actually very important, but you're only an engineer if you have professional autonomy. If you answer to managers and build CRUD apps to support their careers rather than your own, then you're not a professional.

Right now, most of us live under a worst-of-both-worlds regime where it's not clear whether we're genuine professionals, entre- or "intra"preneurs, or glorified labor. Of course, this allows management to frame-change freely among all of the possibilities depending on the specific negotiation, leaving us with the bottom of each possibility.

Re: A Proposal: Renaming Backend/Frontend to Application/UI Developers

#19

Post by bruceboughton »

michaelochurch wrote: post #16

Zed Shaw already solved this problem: http://programming-motherfucker.com . What made programming great (before the Douchebag Invasion came in and we were divided into these stupid warring camps) is now what makes "data science" attractive: the generalist flair and the ability to pick your projects and move around the economy by your own sail. By the way, I personally hate the term "software engineer", at least as co…

>> Genuine software engineering (like, what people who build rockets do, where attention to code quality is critical and people actually consider proving code) is actually very important, but you're only an engineer if you have professional autonomy. If you answer to managers and build CRUD apps to support their careers rather than your own, then you're not a professional.

Because people who build rockets don't have to answer to middle management...

Read Mike Mullane's book [1] if you genuinely believe that

[1] http://mikemullane.com/riding-rockets/

Re: A Proposal: Renaming Backend/Frontend to Application/UI Developers

#20

Post by edw519 »

michaelochurch wrote: post #16

Zed Shaw already solved this problem: http://programming-motherfucker.com . What made programming great (before the Douchebag Invasion came in and we were divided into these stupid warring camps) is now what makes "data science" attractive: the generalist flair and the ability to pick your projects and move around the economy by your own sail. By the way, I personally hate the term "software engineer", at least as co…

If you answer to managers and build CRUD apps to support their careers rather than your own, then you're not a professional.

Pretty amazing statement from someone whose comments are otherwise among the best here on Hacker News.

1. CRUD apps run the world. They were here long before all this sexy unnecssary stuff and will be here long after these fads pass.

2. Whether you want to admit it or not, everyone answers to someone.

3. Make no mistake about it: if you build anything, you benefit, often more than those you built it for. In fact, to become an excellent programmer, there is no better way. It doesn't matter who you built it for, it just matters that you built it.

4. Literal definition of "professional": earns money. There's probably no better way to be a professional programmer than to build corporate CRUD apps. Looser definition of "professional": someone I would want to march into digital battle with. I would most certainly pick someone who has written many corporate CRUD apps over someone who has recently embraced some sexy new technology from the conference and community du jour.

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