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Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

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Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#371

Post by pessimizer »

obviouslygreen wrote: post #321
zachlipton wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't the hypothetical where you're stealing a loaf of bread from the market to feed your starving family. I certainly respect that taking the moral high ground isn't always easy and that some people are going to be in situations where it is more difficult for them to do so than for others. But the standard for acting like an asshole has to be greater than simple expediency. The necessity of breaking the social…

Unfortunately, your analogy is excessively dramatic and misses the reality of the situation. It's easy to create surreal situations in which absolute visions of your own morals apply. Sorry, but you just don't get it.

Because your hand-waving and appeals to authority are so much more relevant?

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#372

Post by anoopelias »

seiji wrote: post #150
bitcartel wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to nip this in the bud. Maybe it's time to create a Hippocratic Oath for developers to publicly commit to? A future Path developer could then refuse to implement an unethical "feature" by pointing out that the company had hired them with the full knowledge that the oath had been undertaken. I don't think the company would pink slip the developer, as they would probably want to avoid any attention being drawn…

A "Hippocratic Oath for developers" sounds like a great idea, but we vastly underestimate the number of jerkbags in the world. People want validation. Line-level employees want praise from coworkers and bosses. Executives want praise from their peers, investors, industry, and press. Concepts like ethics, "right," or even this-is-good-for-thie-world isn't a concern when faced with "X will increase my social status and…

> The ones who feel shame would take the Hippogrammer Oath. Those who revel in manipulating others and standing on their broken bodies will rake in all the profits while the good guys just sit around and "play nice."

I think it is important that we should realize this kind of mentality won't work. You might see bad people making money, but eventually it will be no good for them. Either they don't sustain, or the money is no good for them, or they can't sleep with all that money under their pillow. You will see lot of examples of this from history.

I have seen people who are ethical and right also make a lot of profits. May be not in the short term, but in the long term. The idea is, you don't go behind money, instead you do what you do best, and money will come behind you.

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#373

Post by bobsy »

seiji wrote: post #150
bitcartel wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to nip this in the bud. Maybe it's time to create a Hippocratic Oath for developers to publicly commit to? A future Path developer could then refuse to implement an unethical "feature" by pointing out that the company had hired them with the full knowledge that the oath had been undertaken. I don't think the company would pink slip the developer, as they would probably want to avoid any attention being drawn…

A "Hippocratic Oath for developers" sounds like a great idea, but we vastly underestimate the number of jerkbags in the world. People want validation. Line-level employees want praise from coworkers and bosses. Executives want praise from their peers, investors, industry, and press. Concepts like ethics, "right," or even this-is-good-for-thie-world isn't a concern when faced with "X will increase my social status and…

I am not a jerkbag yet multiple times I have put my beliefs to one side to implement something I really didn't want to do. It made me sad and demoralized for weeks. Yet the choice between sticking to values and feeding family is not a difficult one to make in the end.

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#374

Post by lcentdx »

anoopelias wrote: post #372
seiji wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A "Hippocratic Oath for developers" sounds like a great idea, but we vastly underestimate the number of jerkbags in the world. People want validation. Line-level employees want praise from coworkers and bosses. Executives want praise from their peers, investors, industry, and press. Concepts like ethics, "right," or even this-is-good-for-thie-world isn't a concern when faced with "X will increase my social status and…

> The ones who feel shame would take the Hippogrammer Oath. Those who revel in manipulating others and standing on their broken bodies will rake in all the profits while the good guys just sit around and "play nice." I think it is important that we should realize this kind of mentality won't work. You might see bad people making money, but eventually it will be no good for them. Either they don't sustain, or the mone…

you underestimate humans' ability to conceive themselves doing good while actually immoral, i.e. hypocracy.

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#375

Post by TazeTSchnitzel »

bobsy wrote: post #373
seiji wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A "Hippocratic Oath for developers" sounds like a great idea, but we vastly underestimate the number of jerkbags in the world. People want validation. Line-level employees want praise from coworkers and bosses. Executives want praise from their peers, investors, industry, and press. Concepts like ethics, "right," or even this-is-good-for-thie-world isn't a concern when faced with "X will increase my social status and…

I am not a jerkbag yet multiple times I have put my beliefs to one side to implement something I really didn't want to do. It made me sad and demoralized for weeks. Yet the choice between sticking to values and feeding family is not a difficult one to make in the end.

This is why we got mad at the top of the Nazi regime, not the bottom. The workers just needed to feed their families, the ones at the top orchestrated the evils.

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#376

Post by arethuza »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #375
bobsy wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not a jerkbag yet multiple times I have put my beliefs to one side to implement something I really didn't want to do. It made me sad and demoralized for weeks. Yet the choice between sticking to values and feeding family is not a difficult one to make in the end.

This is why we got mad at the top of the Nazi regime, not the bottom. The workers just needed to feed their families, the ones at the top orchestrated the evils.

There were plenty people at the lower levels of the Nazi regime who were put in trial if they were considered to have committed crimes (e.g. concentration camp guards).

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#378

Post by __chrismc »

pjbrunet wrote: post #312
gtaylor wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android shows the permissions each app is requesting before you install, and even lets you know if they change their permissions between updates. While what Path did is crappy, they didn't subvert the Android permissions system. The thing that burnt the poster is that while a social app asking for access to their contacts might not rise a brow, the user has no way to know what they are going to do with that data with…

"Android shows the permissions each app is requesting before you install" Yes and no. Google often hides the most offensive permission requests under that "see more" arrow. And the permission requests (and accompanying explanations) are too vague and ambiguous. For example: Does "request access to network" mean they're able to sniff all my incoming/outgoing data, granting the app access to everything?

That, and the page is designed so most people will click the "Accept & Download" button without even reading the top-level permission requests.

It's got the title and button at the top, taking up a large chunk of space (1/3rd on my Nexus 4), and then a vague list of - to most users - technical-sounding "stuff".

My guess is a large majority of users never look past the button.

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#379

Post by nnnnni »

darxius wrote: post #192
nnnnni wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you wear the ring then, eh?

Soon :) I'm just entering my final year of study.

I'm not sure where you are, but... be sure to wear a lot of layers of clothes with at least one all-black layer on the finals day.

Seriously. I hope that you'll see this in time!

Re: Path texts my entire phonebook at 6 AM

#380

Post by girvo »

UnoriginalGuy wrote: post #288
Me1000 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without addressing the opt-in point, which I agree with... You're also assuming there is no "continue without doing this" button, which of course, I was assuming there would be... Many users just mash on the "next" button on app intro screens. Again, it's all just speculation until someone takes the time to start researching and documenting the facts instead of just yelling "KILL IT"! :/

You "assume" there would be? You worked for Path...

Classy. Interning at a company and having not been there for 9 months (see above) obviously counts for nothing.

For what it's worth, I disagree with Path and Me1000's arguments. Doesn't mean us here at HN should be attacking him or ignoring his points because of that, nor does it mean that doxing him is acceptable.

Really disappointed with HN in this thread :/

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