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Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

greenheartgames.com

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Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#161
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sim City is another good example of this. Even as a child when I first played the original, I remember reacting to the tax model in the game and how it affects net migration, as it was nothing like what I knew from Norway (and indeed, it bears little resemblance to how things works in most of Europe). A newspaper in Norway recently had to social economists play the most recent Sim City game to review the economic mod…

But Norway is the last communist state, so it should not surprise anyone of that comparison.

That's a ridiculous claim, but even if it were true, it would still not detract from the point. Quite the opposite, in fact.

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#162

While I think this is a very clever idea, it's also somewhat dishonest. In the game world, pirates cause studios to go bankrupt. In the real world, the causal link is not as clear. People arguing that piracy is ruining gamedev routinely ignore the fact that those who pirate don't necessarily have the means to buy many games; their choice is purely between pirating and not playing. Of those 90% or more who pirate the…

My favorite are the people who pirate the game at release and then buy it when it's in the bargain bin for $5, as if that undoes the initial act of piracy: "See? I bought it!"

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#163
Since the devs uploaded the game on bittorrent themselves, isn't it now implicitly legal to share that copy? Obviously not the unaltered copy, but if you upload something to which you own the copyright to bittorrent, you must be either implicitly giving people the right to share it with others, or you're entrapping them into committing a copyright violation. Can the devs then be sued for knowingly tricking people into committing a copyright violation?

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of interest, why do you think that is? Is it due to convenience , availability of cheap games in sales , extra features in steam or did a rise in your disposable income just happen to coincide with the launch of steam? For me it was mainly 2 and 4.

It's a combination of convenience, sales, rise in disposable income, and the fact that I don't have time to play more expensive big-name titles (plus, I like indie games more). The other day I saw a trailer about a game I found visually stunning (Anno 2100? I forget the number), and I checked the price on Steam. It was too expensive for something I'd play once or twice, and I thought of pirating it, but then couldn't…

I find myself reluctant to buy games that are not in sales, even if the normal price would be reasonable to me.

I wonder if there were less sales whether I would spend more on games, spend the same on less games or simply pirate more.

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#165
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People arguing that piracy is ruining gamedev routinely ignore the fact that those who pirate don't necessarily have the means to buy many games And people who defend pirates routinely ignore that pirated products are also pirated by people who will take what they want for free if they can, because they can. Don't pretend to a higher level of intellectual honesty or moral strength. Your position can lay claim to ne…

Are people who go outside and drink from a stream (through a filter/firewall, of course), stealing? What about people who take in the scenery, or people who breath? Is nature a starving artist? I'm not for dumping toxic waste in the river, or stealing property, but the Internet is my environment, and copying data is not only cheap, that's what I pay my ISP to be able to do. IMHO, that makes copying as moral as breath…

The fallacy with this argument is that if everyone behaved if you did there would be no games. If this stuff is "free" it's the tragedy of the commons http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons - except in this case it's developer resources that are "common" and will be depleted as there wouldn't be money to pay for them.

I think at this point everyone understands that there's piracy out there and it's not going away. The thing that irks me is the moral argument like yours (provided it's not a troll, I can't be sure) - I just wish people would admit that they're taking something for free that they shouldn't - no one is saying "trust me - you'll like it," don't give me that "after I evaluate" stuff - you can read dozens of reviews and watch full play-through movies on Youtube. I wish people would just admit that they are scumbags.

Extremely tiny scumbags in the grand scheme of things - less than folks taking a candybar from a corner store as digital goods, as you noted, are freely copyable without cost, but scumbags nonetheless as you are the leeches that make things worse for folks willing to pay for stuff. If you're a student and have no cash but want to play every game that comes out, you're probably going to pirate, but don't create this entire moral structure of justification to compensate for your being a freeloader. Just accept a the tiniest twinge of moral responsibility as you play your free game and become a better person down the road.

As someone who enjoys playing large-scale single player games on PC - Skyrim and the like - I'm upset because more and more developer resources are going to switch to F2P and "always online" games because those are the only ones that "beat" piracy and there are going to be less titles out for the PC and more that just are on console the next generation of locked-down consoles.

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is how analytics applications work. Almost every website you visit has Google Analytics installed, which sends your data to their servers so that the developer gets a better understanding of their users. Apps aren't an exception, you'll find it in almost all of them. When you install the app it should notify you what is does or doesn't have access to, so things like your phone book and call history are not acces…

Veering off topic, but I wonder what people would say if analytics for websites required telling the user what data is being gathered about them before requiring an active opt-in.

No, that's entirely on topic for this particular point.

I know and you know this kind of tracking is industry standard because we are in this industry.

Most people outside this industry don't know that, and are pretty shocked when they see. Seriously, if you have access to a Google Analytics account with a reasonable amount of data start showing people how much stuff you are tracking and see what their reaction is.

Telling OP their "phone home" concerns aren't valid because that's "standard practice" is a terrible argument.

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A college degree is also not guaranteed to lead to a job immediately either, particularly if there are alternative sources of the expertise. (There is no equivalent to copyright, in that sense, guaranteeing a student the right to be the sole provider of their expertise because they paid to receive it...) Every sale is still a negotiation. I've said in the past that I think the economics of copies boils down to beggin…

Getting a college degree will likely get you a job if there is demand in the area in which you did your degree. Imagine the situation where you get your CS degree but find that few people are willing to pay for programmers or software and the people who are willing to pay will still not pay very much yet the demand for software is still very high. Such a situation doesn't make sense in a rational market. Problem with…

"Such a situation doesn't make sense in a rational market." Tell that to philosophy majors. :)

I can also turn on the radio and receive music for free, with ads. TPB has plenty of those (but isn't distributing anything themselves, so arguably isn't infringing... Perhaps they are facilitating, but if so they are largely facilitating non-commercial infringement; I can't imagine anyone downloading a movie and selling it would be common). Radio stations usually pay royalties, otherwise they would be commercially infringing copyright. I mention elsewhere that I can sympathize with commercial copyright enforcement.

Non-commercial copyright infringement is harder to value IMHO. In the case of commercial copyright infringement, there is positive income, and the profit can be fought over. Now that we have dropped boxed distribution media and gone digital only for most types of content (and, importantly, I pay for my ISP), the "profit" to the infringer, and the cost to the originator, from any given copy is at best very ambiguous. The profit to argue over could be positive, non-existent, or negative (heck, they might be wasting their life, watching Game of Thrones, when they could be creating value). There is nothing obvious to fight over in the case of non-commercial copyright infringement, except the copy itself (whether the copier had the right to copy). But preventing copies needs a system similar to a cable TV network, not an amoebae-like Internet.

I like the Internet and the ability to speak freely, and to mix what I find, too much to enforce copyright (even my own) anymore. It's taken a long time for me to get here, and I used to want to be a professional artist.

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are people who go outside and drink from a stream (through a filter/firewall, of course), stealing? What about people who take in the scenery, or people who breath? Is nature a starving artist? I'm not for dumping toxic waste in the river, or stealing property, but the Internet is my environment, and copying data is not only cheap, that's what I pay my ISP to be able to do. IMHO, that makes copying as moral as breath…

That said, I do support artists and research, etc, only I do it after I evaluate them and feel like I got something - similar to how I choose to upvote/downvote on HN, only there is no way to downvote a game producer after you have paid for something you didn't know in advance that you would like. And luckily, a lot of games (this one included) come with a free demo, so that you can try them before buying them. So fo…

The demo for Linux said something like ‘coming soon’ earlier (the page seems a little slow at the moment) and I was unable to find any information whatsoever regarding hardware and software requirements before being asked for my credit card details.

Re: Pirates playing a game dev simulator complain about piracy

#170

While I think this is a very clever idea, it's also somewhat dishonest. In the game world, pirates cause studios to go bankrupt. In the real world, the causal link is not as clear. People arguing that piracy is ruining gamedev routinely ignore the fact that those who pirate don't necessarily have the means to buy many games; their choice is purely between pirating and not playing. Of those 90% or more who pirate the…

This is certainly interesting but I agree that most pirates won't purchase anyway. When I was younger I pirated EVERYTHING. I downloaded music, pc/console games (modded every console I ever could), movies, software. There was no way I could afford to buy all these things at the time and neither could my parents.

Now I have a nice paying job. I buy all my games. I pay for software. A few days ago an artist I like released an album on iTunes and other sites for free. I paid the $9 for it.

I'm not saying that pirating because you don't have the means to purchase something is right, but I am saying it happens.

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