Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
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Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
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Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#2I wonder, is there a video of the talk available? The slides, unfortunately, alone are rarely very informative.
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#3While I love seeing slides, this deck obviously could use the audio or transcript along with it.
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#4Don't use just one ORM and then declare "ORM's are stupid". The "object = None" / "object_id = None" issue illustrated here is certainly not a mistake every ORM makes.
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#5Don't use just one ORM and then declare "ORM's are stupid". The "object = None" / "object_id = None" issue illustrated here is certainly not a mistake every ORM makes.
Do you have an example of an ORM which is not in some fundamental way "stupid"? I haven't found one yet, but I'd love to know one existed somewhere.
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#6Bumping into ORM limitations + moving to Jinja for templates --> one word: Flask
...really, what advantage does Django provide at this point in this project anymore?
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#7Don't use just one ORM and then declare "ORM's are stupid". The "object = None" / "object_id = None" issue illustrated here is certainly not a mistake every ORM makes.
Do you have an example of an ORM which is not in some fundamental way "stupid"? I haven't found one yet, but I'd love to know one existed somewhere.
Until we've attained AI, all software can be said to be "stupid". Google is stupid. Relational databases are stupid, SQL is stupid. None of it works without human intelligence actively directing it to do work for us. Why single out ORMs?
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#8Don't use just one ORM and then declare "ORM's are stupid". The "object = None" / "object_id = None" issue illustrated here is certainly not a mistake every ORM makes.
Do you have an example of an ORM which is not in some fundamental way "stupid"? I haven't found one yet, but I'd love to know one existed somewhere.
There are several Micro ORMs for .NET:
http://www.servicestack.net/benchmarks/#dapper-benchmarks
That don't try to handle hidden-magic-state and lets you easily access via Raw SQL if you need to do complex queries. Many don't try to abstract anything and are simply extension methods over the underlying IDbConnection (so you never lose any flexibility), i.e. they simply exist to remove the tedium boilerplate of mapping RDBMS results back into POCOs.
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do you have an example of an ORM which is not in some fundamental way "stupid"? I haven't found one yet, but I'd love to know one existed somewhere.
Until we've attained AI, all software can be said to be "stupid". Google is stupid. Relational databases are stupid, SQL is stupid. None of it works without human intelligence actively directing it to do work for us. Why single out ORMs?
You're contradicting yourself. Your first comment indicates that it's wrong to label ORMs as "stupid". Yet in this latest comment, you've labeled all software (which includes ORMs, of course) as "stupid".
Like the other commenter requested, can you provide an example of an ORM that isn't "stupid"? Your initial comment makes it sound like you've worked with at least one that isn't. We're curious to learn about which these may be.
Re: Lessons learned defying Joel Spolsky with Django
#10I found I could follow along with the slides, though some of the icons and messages around third-party tools were lost on me. I'd definitely appreciate a video.
Edit: 9 minutes ago, Nick posted to Twitter: "we have the recording - just need the sound cleaned up. Expect it early next week ;)"