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GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

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Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#131

Post by cosmez »

eridius wrote: post #130
cosmez wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gender problems depends a lot on where are you living. That's not the case where i live in, why? because we do not care about such things, treat woman and man the same way. unlike the old american racism, in modern countries there are no laws that discriminate girls.. why should we teach our daughters to fight for something that's not a problem? Education is all we need, why should they hide their code? they should b…

Where do you live? I have an extremely hard time believing that there is no gender inequality where you live. Far more likely is simply that you're blind to the inequality, having grown up immersed in male privilege.

Mexico, it looks like you're taking this too personal, keep calm and happy coding :)

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#132

Post by [deleted] »

eridius wrote: post #130
cosmez wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gender problems depends a lot on where are you living. That's not the case where i live in, why? because we do not care about such things, treat woman and man the same way. unlike the old american racism, in modern countries there are no laws that discriminate girls.. why should we teach our daughters to fight for something that's not a problem? Education is all we need, why should they hide their code? they should b…

Where do you live? I have an extremely hard time believing that there is no gender inequality where you live. Far more likely is simply that you're blind to the inequality, having grown up immersed in male privilege.

[deleted]

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#133

Post by [deleted] »

cosmez wrote: post #128
jmj42 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you got it wrong. >if you think that being a boy or a girl its an advantage then you are part of that problem Unwillingness to recognize that women are at a disadvantage due to long-term social mores is part of the problem. "Boys will always be boys, ignore them and move on?" You really don't get it, do you? Every little comment, snide remark, finger pointing... Words are sharp, they cut deep. In the end, it's th…

Like i said before.. this is not a world wide social problem, my college was almost half boys, half girls. The highest grade was a girl, why? not because she was a girl.. but because she was freaking smart. Its like african americans complaining about racism, i don't get it.. they are the coolest thing on earth right now!! Ignore that uneducated minority and move on.

[deleted]

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#134

Post by derrida »

cosmez wrote: post #128
jmj42 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you got it wrong. >if you think that being a boy or a girl its an advantage then you are part of that problem Unwillingness to recognize that women are at a disadvantage due to long-term social mores is part of the problem. "Boys will always be boys, ignore them and move on?" You really don't get it, do you? Every little comment, snide remark, finger pointing... Words are sharp, they cut deep. In the end, it's th…

Like i said before.. this is not a world wide social problem, my college was almost half boys, half girls. The highest grade was a girl, why? not because she was a girl.. but because she was freaking smart. Its like african americans complaining about racism, i don't get it.. they are the coolest thing on earth right now!! Ignore that uneducated minority and move on.

cosmez:

> Its like african americans complaining about racism, i don't get it.. they are the coolest thing on earth right now!! Ignore that uneducated minority and move on.

rac·ism /ˈrāˌsizəm/

Noun

The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race.

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#135

Post by jmj42 »

cosmez wrote: post #128
jmj42 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you got it wrong. >if you think that being a boy or a girl its an advantage then you are part of that problem Unwillingness to recognize that women are at a disadvantage due to long-term social mores is part of the problem. "Boys will always be boys, ignore them and move on?" You really don't get it, do you? Every little comment, snide remark, finger pointing... Words are sharp, they cut deep. In the end, it's th…

Like i said before.. this is not a world wide social problem, my college was almost half boys, half girls. The highest grade was a girl, why? not because she was a girl.. but because she was freaking smart. Its like african americans complaining about racism, i don't get it.. they are the coolest thing on earth right now!! Ignore that uneducated minority and move on.

I'm sure there are areas of the world where gender equality isn't a problem, but where your're from (mexico as indicated above) it most certainly is. A quick internet search came up with hundreds of articles on the gender equality issues in Mexico, including, a female to male income ratio of .62, ranking Mexico 53rd (USA is 13th at .67).

So guess what, privileged male, it is a very big problem where you live.

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#136

Post by pifflesnort »

eridius wrote: post #105
cosmez wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That last paragraph is exactly the reason i hate this sexist talks, it doesn't matter if its the boys or girls that are complaining.. I don't know if that's the case in the place you are living right now but, if you think that being a boy or a girl its an advantage then you are part of that problem.. Boys will always be boys, ignore them and move on.

If you can't recognize that men have a vast amount of privilege compared to women, then I don't really know what to say. Last year a man named Geordie Tait posted an article called "To My Someday Daughter"[1]. It's quite long, but definitely worth reading. The context is gaming, but the central thesis is sexism. One quote from the article that really opened my eyes to how radically different men and women view the wo…

> If you can't recognize that men have a vast amount of privilege compared to women, then I don't really know what to say.

The locally-defined concept of "male privilege" is quite possibly the least productive gender generalization to use in a conversation about gender equality.

This -- along with redefinitions of vocabulary to justify offense (see the comment about 'female' being offensive), and truisms that assert that any opposition to preferred policy is opposition to gender equality (see the reference to Lewis's law, or your own murder quote), are why these conversations are so pointlessly and ridiculously laden in rhetorical nonsense as to be useless.

> "Men and women live in different worlds. At core, men are afraid women will laugh at them, while at core, women are afraid men will kill them." And according to my girlfriend, this is not even the slightest bit exaggerated.

According to my wife, this is ridiculous and your girlfriend should adopt a more fact-based view of the world.

I looked it up. From 2000 to 2010, there were 128,971 male victims of murder in the US. There were 35,777 female victims.

http://projects.wsj.com/murderdata

To use your own rhetorical approach: if you disagree with me, "then I don't really know what to say". (sarcasm intended).

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#137

Post by pifflesnort »

steveklabnik wrote: post #112
bdg wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? Right now that's just reading like a baseless claim and it sounds ridiculous to me that "females" is derogatory. I've never heard of such a claim before in my entire life.

There are two reasons why "female" is problematic: 1. It refers to sex, not gender. I know many women who do not possess a vagina. 2. It sounds very clinical and sterile. It's appropriate for, say, a scientific survey, but not for addressing other humans with the respect they deserve. I don't refer to 'men' as 'males,' either.

> There are two reasons why "female" is problematic: ..

Your reply demonstrates some standard rhetorical landmines used by fringe groups:

1) Redefine words within your subculture (in this case: 'gender', 'sex', 'male', and 'female') and then use the new definitions to claim externally inconsiderate use of those words.

2) Assume that whether or not someone was offended ultimately defines ethical norms (especially when tied to #1, redefining vocabulary to create reasons for offense).

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#138

Post by sneak »

jubalfh wrote: post #129
sneak wrote: post #109

The fact that they partnered with the destructive and notorious Ada Initiative is disappointing. They are little more than concern-trolls, and they are doing far more to hinder equality than promote it. GitHub is full of great people and poor choices like this are incongruent. PS: This isn't male privilege speaking - The Ada Initiative is disliked (for very good reason) by feminists of both genders.

Do substantiate.

They have a history of drama-generation and concern-trolling related to conference organizers and speakers over things that have absolutely nothing to do with womens' rights, equality, or discrimination, which are then dressed up as feminism and used to censor and attack others (who are not participating in discrimination or furthering discriminatory ideas) based on the personal sex-negative agendas of those running the Ada Initiative.

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2013/03/01/stigmatizin...

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#139

Post by sneak »

marquis wrote: post #119
sneak wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't conflate people being ignorant of their privilege with legitimate criticism of The Ada Initiative. The Ada Initiative is a destructive and notorious concern-troll organization that is reviled by many feminists of both genders. They hurt all real initiatives for resolving inequality and bias in technology. Supporting them is destructive.

Can you back this statement up please? I'm interested to hear where these comments originate.

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2013/03/01/stigmatizin...

...is one good example of their concern-trolling.

They dress up their own sex-negative bullshit in feminist clothing and use it to censor and attack people who do not engage in discrimination or sexism in any way whatsoever, based solely on their own personal agendas.

It's repugnant to every single feminist (of any gender) that I've spoken to familiar with these events.

As far as I can tell, it seems to me to be the outgrowth of various personality disorders possessed by Valerie Aurora, the founder of the Ada Initiative. It serves as a convenient venue for her to attack others under the guise of promoting equal rights. It appears that she only supports equal rights as long as you are presenting exclusively on topics that she approves of.

Re: GitHub donates private repositories to women learning open source software

#140

Post by juridatenshi »

marquis wrote: post #123
juridatenshi wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed with you about the donations. Tangentially, it would be cool if GitHub had more diversity in their software engineering staff - that is something they have control over.

A really good way to increase the diversity of your staff is to encourage education for minority groups.

Definitely. I'm excited they're doing this, and I think it is useful. :)

The comment about hiring was mostly an aside as something else I wish they were taking more active efforts with in addition to efforts like this one.

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