A new search engine • Hacker News Board

Re: A new search engine

#31

Post by saejox » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:21 AM UTC

I find it funny that a Google competitor search engine using Google Analytics and AdSense.

Re: A new search engine

#32

Post by Dn_Ab » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:32 AM UTC

fmoralesc wrote: post #24

OK. My first try was to search for "plato dialogue concerning friendship". Google gave me the result I expected (a reference to the Lysis dialogue) through wikipedia and a bunch of articles about it (the most helpful being a link to the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy, ranked third). It didn't link the text though in the first page (it only appears in the third page of results, with a copy at the MIT Classics arc…

Counterpoint. I was surprised by it. A couple weeks ago I decided to start recording any search phrases which I felt were tricky or required good language modelling.

"baby features kept in adulthood" is the only one I've thought worth recording so far. You can compare the results in Google, Bing, DDG. Only Samuru and Google have it on page 1. Samuru has it as the first result. But this is just one example so I can't draw any conclusions. Curious to see how well it performs in general.

Re: A new search engine

#33

Post by Matt_Cutts » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:33 AM UTC

drakaal wrote: post #30

Matt_Cutts wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey Brandon, congrats on launching Samuru! I'll be curious what you think of running a search engine after being an SEO for so many years.

I am enjoying it. We went with the approach of how can we make this impossible for Brandon Wirtz to game. How can we make this about the content more than a popularity contest. Now that we are both in the business of stopping spam we should grab lunch sometime.

I'll be up in Seattle in June for the SMX Advanced conference. Not sure if you'll be at SMX?

Re: A new search engine

#34

Post by sashagim » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:33 AM UTC

drakaal wrote: post #15

I didn't submit this. I didn't know anyone was submitting it. Or I would have written a post about why it is different than other search engines. Better is still up for grabs because it is new. Samuru doesn't use link authority, it analyzes pages and matches what you queried to the types of pages and picks the best matches. Let me give you an example. You search for "How to Make cupcakes" Google says give me the page…

So how exactly do you get better results 30 seconds later? How do you index more relevant pages? Do you... Google it?

Re: A new search engine

#35

Post by DanBC » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:41 AM UTC

I wish you luck with this!

Google is excellent. Bing is also excellent (with minor differences). DDG and Blekko are adding interesting and useful features.

But they all feel a bit like they're a mono-culture, and thus vulnerable to gaming. Black-hat seo seems to be something that Google is pretty good[1] at dealing with. White hat SEO and ads have changed the web drastically from what I remember.

So it's really nice to have an alternative method of search that searches in a different way. Your post (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5580321) highlights a few things I find frustrating in search at the moment.

[1] It's odd that all the work they do isn't noticed.

Re: A new search engine

#36

Post by drakaal » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:42 AM UTC

Matt_Cutts wrote: post #33

drakaal wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am enjoying it. We went with the approach of how can we make this impossible for Brandon Wirtz to game. How can we make this about the content more than a popularity contest. Now that we are both in the business of stopping spam we should grab lunch sometime.

I'll be up in Seattle in June for the SMX Advanced conference. Not sure if you'll be at SMX?

Maybe. I'm in Phoenix because that's where Stremor is based, but I'll hit you up next time I am in Mountain View

Re: A new search engine

#37

Post by drakaal » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:42 AM UTC

sashagim wrote: post #34

drakaal wrote: post #15

I didn't submit this. I didn't know anyone was submitting it. Or I would have written a post about why it is different than other search engines. Better is still up for grabs because it is new. Samuru doesn't use link authority, it analyzes pages and matches what you queried to the types of pages and picks the best matches. Let me give you an example. You search for "How to Make cupcakes" Google says give me the page…

So how exactly do you get better results 30 seconds later? How do you index more relevant pages? Do you... Google it?

We have a shallow index of pages. We do a Deep index only if a page then shows up in search results.

Re: A new search engine

#38

Post by danso » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:51 AM UTC

drakaal wrote: post #15

I didn't submit this. I didn't know anyone was submitting it. Or I would have written a post about why it is different than other search engines. Better is still up for grabs because it is new. Samuru doesn't use link authority, it analyzes pages and matches what you queried to the types of pages and picks the best matches. Let me give you an example. You search for "How to Make cupcakes" Google says give me the page…

Re: your portrayal of how Google works...An "over simplification"? It's just plain wrong. Google has, for quite awhile, not depended on sites containing all the words of a query...and natural language processing plays a huge part in analyzing intent of a query.

I applaud this ambitious project but I'm skeptical you'll achieve what you aim for if you're way off the mark in understanding how Google is so successful...I mean, to even talk of replacing Google at this stage -- and saying it's just a matter of providing rich snippets and other ancillary features as if that was your engine's main deficiency compared to Google -- is quite bold and a little cart before horse, IMO

-

Edit: an example...I did a search for my own name, something I do habitually because I'm locked in an eternal struggle with a younger, better looking, more talented namesake for the top Google result. However, your search engine returns neither me nor my singing rival as the top result...instead you return the domain that is my first and last name with a hyphen, which is exactly the superficial result that Google was designed to avoid.

Re: A new search engine

#39

Post by sashagim » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 6:54 AM UTC

drakaal wrote: post #37

sashagim wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how exactly do you get better results 30 seconds later? How do you index more relevant pages? Do you... Google it?

We have a shallow index of pages. We do a Deep index only if a page then shows up in search results.

thanks

Re: A new search engine

#40

Post by drakaal » Sat, Apr 20, 2013, 7:04 AM UTC

danso wrote: post #38

drakaal wrote: post #15

I didn't submit this. I didn't know anyone was submitting it. Or I would have written a post about why it is different than other search engines. Better is still up for grabs because it is new. Samuru doesn't use link authority, it analyzes pages and matches what you queried to the types of pages and picks the best matches. Let me give you an example. You search for "How to Make cupcakes" Google says give me the page…

Re: your portrayal of how Google works...An "over simplification"? It's just plain wrong. Google has, for quite awhile, not depended on sites containing all the words of a query...and natural language processing plays a huge part in analyzing intent of a query. I applaud this ambitious project but I'm skeptical you'll achieve what you aim for if you're way off the mark in understanding how Google is so successful...I…

So you think Google knows if a piece of content is instructional?

Or know that it is a Review? (not just has a rating)

And you have to have all the words or a synonym of the words. But more importantly Google doesn't know what kind of content something is. Or what questions the content answers. Our system knows "this document answers what do aardvarks eat"