Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 46 posts

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#11

Post by michaelochurch »

codewright wrote: post #10
epenn wrote: post #6

I would love to see something like this. I think this shouldn't just be limited to one city or industry though. Assuming that this is successfully attempted in one city, it might be a good idea to try it in other cities while focusing on various industries that speak to the existing core competencies of that city. So for example, a Detroit version of the Autonomy Fund could focus on funding autonomous individuals wit…

I don't think Pittsburgh has the funding to do it. You're looking at a budget of ~$450mm. I think the funding, rather than the locale, is the blocker here.

How much money do you think it'll take? I'm thinking single-digit millions per year. First class would be about 28 people. So that's $3.5 million per year.

Salary plus tech budget is $125,000. That's half-decent but not great, and by design. I'm looking for entrepreneurs, not salarymen (who'd command $150-250k at the level I'm looking to hire). It's not the extreme low salary of bootstrapping (negative including business expenses) but it's not cozy either. That's sort of what I'm aiming for: a middle path between might-fuck-up-your-family-life-bootstrapping and not-really-an-entrepreneur-VC-funded-salaryman.

I'm also thinking that it would be useful to find private investment with 1:1 matching. So local governments would only have to kick in half the initial funding requirement

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#12

Post by pekk »

It's an interesting idea, but I don't think local governments have room to pay lots of engineer salaries for no specific reason. Startups are risky and this will smell even riskier since it scans politically as a boondoggle. $125,000 is 5 working-class jobs. I don't see cities directly 'creating' jobs by just paying people to do things.

So, maybe don't depend on local governments.

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#13

Post by mahyarm »

Copying my comment from here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5578223

---

How about Las Vegas? I've never been there but:

1) Cheap airfare, international destination

2) A Party Town, probably helps the gender balance in one aspect, people would like to visit you.

3) No Income Tax

4) Still close to the SF Bay Area

5) Never cold, barely rains (good or bad depending on your preferences)

6) Really cheap real estate. Buy a townhouse for under $100k!

7) Many tech conventions are hosted there

8) Driving from one corner to another takes only 30 minutes according to google maps.

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#14

Post by michaelochurch »

pekk wrote: post #12

It's an interesting idea, but I don't think local governments have room to pay lots of engineer salaries for no specific reason. Startups are risky and this will smell even riskier since it scans politically as a boondoggle. $125,000 is 5 working-class jobs. I don't see cities directly 'creating' jobs by just paying people to do things. So, maybe don't depend on local governments.

Or, here's an idea (that might be politically explosive, or really cool): the funding is contingent upon teaching local school students (at various grade levels) programming (which is still not part of the curriculum in most public schools)-- a 10-15 hour per week commitment. This does mean that we must select for people willing to teach, but as far as I'm concerned, if you're not a good teacher, you're not a good leader and I'm not interested in funding you.

Now, public school students are getting after-school coursework with "Silicon [V]alley technology entrepreneurs". These aren't techies getting thrown a bunch of local money to build their careers; they're getting thrown local money to build businesses and teaching students how programming works in "the real world"

So then, there's a great service provided that is of use to the community even if the startups flop.

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#15

Post by S4M »

It's a nice idea, but focusing of technical excellence for its own sake is dubious according to me. If I were offered to put my own money in that project and get paid in dividends after couple of years (we want long term investors), I would probably refuse, as there is no business plan at all. Whoever has money to invest will focus first on the product, and then on the technical quality. What you want is rather:

1. write good code

2. ???

3. profits

Also, you will need to attract non coders, such as domain experts or marketing. They will also want their shares of the cake, and you will need to pick good ones, which will not be trivial for you as a developer. I am sure there are many other flaws, and I'd rather suggest that you use your technical excellence to "scratch your own itch" and live from it.

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#17

Post by julespitt »

michaelochurch wrote: post #14
pekk wrote: post #12

It's an interesting idea, but I don't think local governments have room to pay lots of engineer salaries for no specific reason. Startups are risky and this will smell even riskier since it scans politically as a boondoggle. $125,000 is 5 working-class jobs. I don't see cities directly 'creating' jobs by just paying people to do things. So, maybe don't depend on local governments.

Or, here's an idea (that might be politically explosive, or really cool): the funding is contingent upon teaching local school students (at various grade levels) programming (which is still not part of the curriculum in most public schools)-- a 10-15 hour per week commitment. This does mean that we must select for people willing to teach, but as far as I'm concerned, if you're not a good teacher, you're not a good le…

I don't think cities or towns have either the money to invest nor the knowhow to administer such a thing. I think it would likely have to be investor-led, preferably wealthy technologists, who would then shop it around to local governments.

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#18

Post by michaelochurch »

kohanz wrote: post #16

Let's see: government funds for projects that have little to no regulation, oversight, or concrete goals. Yeah... good luck with that. I mean, is there any precedent for this? And I actually like the idea!

Ctrl+F "teaching".

If we set up a "20/20" plan where the entrepreneurs spend 15-20 hours teaching (as in, the public) while they draw a salary, then it might work.

The only danger is that it pisses off the teacher's unions. It'd have to be a free after-school program.

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#19

Post by michaelochurch »

julespitt wrote: post #17
michaelochurch wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, here's an idea (that might be politically explosive, or really cool): the funding is contingent upon teaching local school students (at various grade levels) programming (which is still not part of the curriculum in most public schools)-- a 10-15 hour per week commitment. This does mean that we must select for people willing to teach, but as far as I'm concerned, if you're not a good teacher, you're not a good le…

I don't think cities or towns have either the money to invest nor the knowhow to administer such a thing. I think it would likely have to be investor-led, preferably wealthy technologists, who would then shop it around to local governments.

Hmm. That may be right. But I think something real is here, especially now that I've added in the teaching factor.

Do you know anyone who'd be able to look at this idea as a potential principal? My email is michael.o.church at gmail.

Re: Ask HN: Is an Autonomy Fund a viable business model?

#20

Post by michaelochurch »

S4M wrote: post #15

It's a nice idea, but focusing of technical excellence for its own sake is dubious according to me. If I were offered to put my own money in that project and get paid in dividends after couple of years (we want long term investors), I would probably refuse, as there is no business plan at all. Whoever has money to invest will focus first on the product, and then on the technical quality. What you want is rather: 1. w…

Very good points. Thanks so much. I welcome disagreement because, without it, my ideas would stay in a raw crappy form. So... here are my thoughts.

My end goal is for this to congeal into something like an open-allocation environment, but one that exists across companies to some extent. I feel like if we bring OA to the external market, we'll force the hands of employers who will have to improve conditions if they want to compete for talent. So, the trans-corporate open allocation (because each person carries an income that follows her whereever she goes) is the ultimate end goal. That may be completely insane, but isn't that what the open-source gift economy is-- trans-corporate collaboration?

Getting designers, marketers and domain experts will be hard. I grant you that. Strong designers and marketers I can spot; domain expertise I would not be able to tell, unless I had it myself and, of course, for most domains I won't. I think that to get a domain expert, you'd have to hire her into a company already formed through this process, because you're right that there's no way we can build up a competent selection process for every domain we might care about.

Post reply on HN