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The secrets of body language

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Re: The secrets of body language

#61

Post by powrtoch »

e12e wrote: post #53

A couple of points: 1) As far as interviews are concerned (or any dialogue) mirroring might get you further than power -- eg: when your interviewer crosses his/her arms, you might gain an advantage doing the same - whatever the "power poses" theory says. I suppose it is like language: Short, conscience sentences might be "powerful" or "commanding" -- but that alone doesn't make for effective prose in all cases. No co…

Re: #2, My understanding of the experiment is that they simply had people assume poses, and then measured their hormone levels. If they really did tell them up front whether the pose was intended to make them feel powerful, that would certainly be an egregious mistake in the methodology, but that wasn't the impression I had from hearing the TED talk.

Actually, I wonder if you could even pull of that version of the experiment without the participants seeing through it ("No really, shrinking into your chair and looking at the floor is a great display of power!").

Re: The secrets of body language

#62

Post by rtkwe »

kyllo wrote: post #60

This is the actual definition of "cargo cult" behavior. It's getting cause and effect backwards because you don't understand their relationship, and trying to imitate the effect in the futile hope that it will cause the cause. People who sit all relaxed like that do so because they have power. They don't have power because they sit like that, and sitting like that will not magically confer power to you.

The bits about the hormonal changes do seem cargo cultish, but there are some merits in the idea of 'projecting' with your body language.

Act more confident -> Appear more confident -> Be treated differently -> Actually be more confident.

Re: The secrets of body language

#63

Post by JabavuAdams »

bjcy wrote: post #30
JabavuAdams wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But isn't giving respect low-power? If you're the alpha, others give you respect, and you do as you please. I'm exaggerating, obviously, but respect is a form of deference. Deference is low-power.

I disagree. If you're the alpha, others give you respect, but this doesn't imply that you can't show respect to others. Respect is not only a form of deference. It is also a form of understanding.

My statement was too broad -- you're right. However, even giving shows of respect can cement the giver's higher status.

I.e. I can confer honour upon you because I am the source of honour. Maybe I'm watching too much Game of Thrones.

Re: The secrets of body language

#64

Post by JabavuAdams »

saraid216 wrote: post #35
JabavuAdams wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But isn't giving respect low-power? If you're the alpha, others give you respect, and you do as you please. I'm exaggerating, obviously, but respect is a form of deference. Deference is low-power.

Power is not the same thing as domination.

Power is the ability to coerce through action or threat of action on those issues that you care about or in certain spheres of influence.

So, no, this doesn't mean constant domination. But that's largely due to the fact that the powerful won't generally expend their resources on issues they don't care about. As soon as you disagree or oppose them on an issue that they do care about, though, they will try to dominate you.

EDIT> Also, a person may have power within one sphere, but not another. A classic mistake is not realizing who you're dealing with / what the realities of the situation are.

Re: The secrets of body language

#66

Post by zeteo »

This kind of article doesn't address the issue known as Chesterton's fence [1]. If so-called "low power" poses are so bad for you, why have they survived evolution? Why do we have such strong ingrained impulses to assume them in the first place? "Experts" need to give a very, very convincing answer to this question before urging us to abandon such poses.

Anecdotally, I've often been with groups of engineers where everyone was assuming "low power" poses. The discussion seemed to flow more constructively in such circumstances; it was as though everyone admitted that they didn't know the right answers. They felt free to submit very rough ideas because everybody else was just as ignorant and not in a position to shoot them down. Enter a "confident" program manager, however, and the group quickly devolved into silence and/or banalities; everyone felt reluctant to express opinions that they didn't feel completely certain about.

[1] http://epicureandealmaker.blogspot.com/2012/03/chesterton-fe...

Re: The secrets of body language

#67

Post by nostrademons »

felideon wrote: post #40
JabavuAdams wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But isn't giving respect low-power? If you're the alpha, others give you respect, and you do as you please. I'm exaggerating, obviously, but respect is a form of deference. Deference is low-power.

I know what you mean, but given the context of a job interview, by definition[1] you are in a lower power position. I agree with sibling comments, though, that respectfulness is not mutually exclusive with alpha -ness. And if in general you are a respectful person, a high-power posture will probably not impact their opinion of your respectfulness too much. [1] Assuming you really want the job and unless you are a hot…

I've gone into every job interview I've had with the attitude that I'm a hot shot who is gracing my employer with my willingness to work for them[1]. I've gotten offers at about 50% of them, which means that I've turned down more companies than have turned down me.

Confidence really does work. If you sincerely believe in your abilities, it's much easier to convince others to believe in them.

[1] This is not mutually exclusive with respect or humility. It's quite possible to believe you have a lot to offer your employer while also believing they have a lot to offer you, and then the job interview process is just a matter of negotiating the right fit.

Re: The secrets of body language

#68

Post by mamoswined »

zeteo wrote: post #66

This kind of article doesn't address the issue known as Chesterton's fence [1]. If so-called "low power" poses are so bad for you, why have they survived evolution? Why do we have such strong ingrained impulses to assume them in the first place? "Experts" need to give a very, very convincing answer to this question before urging us to abandon such poses. Anecdotally, I've often been with groups of engineers where eve…

From the perspective of primate social structures, the "low power" poses are incredibly important. For a male chimpanzee who doesn't have the physical strength or social clout to defend himself, adopting a submissive posture in the presence of higher ranking male can mean the difference between being tolerated and being beaten up. In a modern environment, I would hope that your boss would not beat you up for adopting a dominant posture, but it does raise the question about whether or not these can lead to an aggression or submissive behavior from other people in meetings. It might be wiser to neutral pose.

Re: The secrets of body language

#69

Post by sliverstorm »

zeteo wrote: post #66

This kind of article doesn't address the issue known as Chesterton's fence [1]. If so-called "low power" poses are so bad for you, why have they survived evolution? Why do we have such strong ingrained impulses to assume them in the first place? "Experts" need to give a very, very convincing answer to this question before urging us to abandon such poses. Anecdotally, I've often been with groups of engineers where eve…

If so-called "low power" poses are so bad for you, why have they survived evolution? Why do we have such strong ingrained impulses to assume them in the first place?

Humans are social animals. In the human social structure, followers are just as important as leaders.

Re: The secrets of body language

#70

Post by [deleted] »

mamoswined wrote: post #68
zeteo wrote: post #66

This kind of article doesn't address the issue known as Chesterton's fence [1]. If so-called "low power" poses are so bad for you, why have they survived evolution? Why do we have such strong ingrained impulses to assume them in the first place? "Experts" need to give a very, very convincing answer to this question before urging us to abandon such poses. Anecdotally, I've often been with groups of engineers where eve…

From the perspective of primate social structures, the "low power" poses are incredibly important. For a male chimpanzee who doesn't have the physical strength or social clout to defend himself, adopting a submissive posture in the presence of higher ranking male can mean the difference between being tolerated and being beaten up. In a modern environment, I would hope that your boss would not beat you up for adopting…

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