Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer • Hacker News Board

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#21

Post by civilian » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:11 AM UTC

jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

Over the period of 2004-2011. So divide by 7.

You should also try to find the vehicular death per 100k statistic.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#22

Post by ryderm » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:11 AM UTC

> The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty.

Well, driving above the speed limit while on duty is required. Why would that be included in the statistic? And driving 90 is hardly out of the ordinary where I'm from. That being said, driving 120 or 130 while off duty is clearly a bad idea.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#23

Post by pyre » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:11 AM UTC

fancyketchup wrote: post #16

jrockway wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure you need to fire someone for driving 125mph at 4 o'clock in the morning. The punishment should fit the crime.

Is it also kosher to drive while intoxicated at 4 o'clock in the morning? I'm not asking to be snarky, I just don't understand the line of reasoning. It seems like you are saying that engaging is behaviors that are risky to other members of the public are ok as long as nobody is hurt on the specific instance in which you engage in them.

I think that idea is that driving at 125mph is less risky at 4am because there are fewer obstacles around. Attempting to drive 125mph at, say, 4pm would be a lot more risky/dangerous.

That said, I don't think that actions outside of work necessarily should mean someone is fired. Using your badge to attempt to get out of trouble, or stating that you feel that speeding is your 'right' (on-duty or off-duty) just because you are a cop, on the other hand...

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#24

Post by discountgenius » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:12 AM UTC

jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

> "800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph"

Technically, couldn't this be 799 guys who meant to go 85 but drifted up to 90 and one jerk who went 130?

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#25

Post by doorhammer » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:12 AM UTC

What makes me happy about this is that it's an example living in the information age. Every day people are gaining more and more tools that can be used to, in a way, force transparency. I think the situation from that standpoint will only get better as stories like this unfold. I really like this one because it's a demonstration that given the right tools, some folks can cut through and make their own transparency.

I'm not saying it's a panacea, but I do think that we live in pretty interesting times for this kind of thing.

Here's hoping it continues in that direction.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#26

Post by corwinstephen » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:18 AM UTC

jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

Frustrating? Yes. Shocking? No.

Did anyone really believe that taking a job as a police officer somehow suppressed these people's natural desire to drive fast? Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place. Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doing it. Why would you expect the cops to be any different? Do you hold them to a higher level of moral responsibility during their off time because of what they do for a living?

Being a police officer is a job. Unless you wanna have robots do it instead, people are going to do what people are going to do.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#27

Post by ryanac » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:24 AM UTC

austenallred wrote: post #17

This lends to a trend that's way to prevalent as of late: There are no checks and/or balances on the Police; the only discipline comes internally, often as a result of public outcry. Perhaps it's the bias of what you actually hear about, but it seems like the worst that can happen to a Police officer is paid leave.

"as of late"? Feels like the lack of checks and balances on the police has been going on for a while.

It's only when something major happens that people take notice, like someone putting together this report, now all of a sudden it's a new trend that's way to prevalent as of late. :P

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#28

Post by yew » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:25 AM UTC

corwinstephen wrote: post #26

jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

Frustrating? Yes. Shocking? No. Did anyone really believe that taking a job as a police officer somehow suppressed these people's natural desire to drive fast? Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place. Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doin…

Do you hold them to a higher level of moral responsibility during their off time because of what they do for a living?

Yes! Of course! Being an officer may be 'just a job', but in practice the hat doesn't come off. Which is the entire point - police officers occupy a particular position in society regardless of whether or not they're wearing a badge at the moment.

That's not the same thing as saying that I'm surprised that they're still human, though.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#29

Post by mrmaddog » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:28 AM UTC

civilian wrote: post #21

jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

Over the period of 2004-2011. So divide by 7. You should also try to find the vehicular death per 100k statistic.

Exactly. Per Wikipedia it is about 12 deaths per 100k on average from the period of 2004-2012. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_motor_vehicle_deaths_...

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#30

Post by jere » Wed, Apr 17, 2013, 1:29 AM UTC

corwinstephen wrote: post #26

jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

Frustrating? Yes. Shocking? No. Did anyone really believe that taking a job as a police officer somehow suppressed these people's natural desire to drive fast? Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place. Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doin…

>Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doing it. Why would you expect the cops to be any different? Do you hold them to a higher level of moral responsibility during their off time because of what they do for a living?

a) A higher standard? Sure. I suppose I'm extremely naive, but if you spend your day punishing people for doing X, I think you should have an appreciation for why you shouldn't be doing X or at least be a role model for not doing X.

b) I actually wouldn't guess that, among the general populace, the majority of people regularly speed at 90-130. Again, that's probably naive. I drive like an elderly person, so I may be biased.