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Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

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Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#31

Post by sanukcm »

bane wrote: post #15
orangethirty wrote: post #5

Yes, you should launch without a product. Yes, you should get orders. Yes to all of that. But you are missing an important thing. A lot of world changing companies out there started without a business plan, much less a sale. It was about trying to see what could be done with X. Sales people don't get this. Tech is not only about making a quick buck, but about creating new things altogether. Sometimes, those new thing…

A lot of world changing companies out there started without a business plan, much less a sale. It was about trying to see what could be done with X. Sales people don't get this. Tech is not only about making a quick buck, but about creating new things altogether. There's an interesting anti-pattern I see in business time and time again...it's the company that's run as follows: 1) Start with a successful product (rega…

Your analysis reminded me of an article I read a few years ago called "Driven off the Road by MBAs"[1].

I won't give a synopsis because it is a really short article - but here (IMO) is the key sentence and take away: "...ultimately, moving numbers around can do only so much. Over the long haul, you've got to invent or improve real products and services to grow."

The author of the article references a book written by Bob Lutz called "Car Guys vs. Bean Counters: The Battle for the Soul of American Business"[2], which contains numerous examples of how replacing executives from engineering backgrounds with executives from more traditional business backgrounds failed GM as a strategy.

[1]- http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2081930,00....

[2]-http://www.amazon.com/Car-Guys-vs-Bean-Counters/product-revi...

Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#33

Post by chriswilliams »

thetrumanshow wrote: post #21

It is a fairly recent development that the tech industry has acquired ways to make building a v1.0 easier. And the salespeople are looking around now, clearly able to tell the extent to which you can execute v1.0 with C-Level talent, and wondering why so many companies are still run by software people. The answer I believe is: because this all used to be much harder, and you had to rely on your engineers to pull you…

100% Agree.

Chris

Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#34

Post by chriswilliams »

jgilliam wrote: post #32

There are tons of software companies run by sales people...they just all fail.

I'd have to disagree with that. To quote Steve Blank himselve, no software ever fails because it can't be build. You can build whatever software you want. Software companies fail because they can't generate cash.

Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#35

Post by craigching »

chriswilliams wrote: post #27
richardjordan wrote: post #14

We tried this before, as an industry. It didn't work. There's a reason investors pattern match away from sales people as founder & CEO of a startup. Sales people are often too good at selling themselves and not so good at getting product out the door. Selling ahead of the curve right up until the point you've burned your market with missed ship dates. Having done both sales (taken product to market leading position f…

Hey Richard, I disagree. "Lean startup" (I've only skimmed, not read) is all about teaching coders to sell. Correct me if I'm wrong, no code should be written unless there is market demand. The challenge is not selling ONCE you have a solid product, it's going from NOTHING to something. Chris

Sometimes vision goes beyond what the market currently demands and changes the dynamics of the market. So "no code should be written unless there is market demand" seems a bit short-sighted to me. If you're a visionary, you're seeing beyond what the market demands.

Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#37

Post by hluska »

chriswilliams wrote: post #27
richardjordan wrote: post #14

We tried this before, as an industry. It didn't work. There's a reason investors pattern match away from sales people as founder & CEO of a startup. Sales people are often too good at selling themselves and not so good at getting product out the door. Selling ahead of the curve right up until the point you've burned your market with missed ship dates. Having done both sales (taken product to market leading position f…

Hey Richard, I disagree. "Lean startup" (I've only skimmed, not read) is all about teaching coders to sell. Correct me if I'm wrong, no code should be written unless there is market demand. The challenge is not selling ONCE you have a solid product, it's going from NOTHING to something. Chris

First, if you haven't read it, how do you know what it's about??

Second, did you skim over anything about the build-measure-learn loop? If so, let's say that you have an idea, build a first (completely fake) version, and get it in front of people. The next step would be to build something that works, right? If you're completely non-technical, how do you find people to take you to that step (and to do it elegantly enough that you can not only learn, but build on top of what you have learned)?

Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#38

Post by craigching »

chriswilliams wrote: post #29
nbouscal wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Salespeople fundamentally do not create. For those of us who are in technology not to build a 'successful' company or pad our bank accounts, but rather to create new things, none of what this guy is talking about really has any relevance.

Disagree. I have bills to pay, and this means selling.

"Bills to pay" or whatever your motivation is, does not mean that's the best way to drive business in a software company. Sales is a required part of business and one driver of how products are developed, but if sales were the only driver of how products are developed, products would be one dimensional pretty quickly with tactical "if you do this, I can make this one sale" types of development features. You still need a robust product management team that is (hopefully) looking beyond current sales needs.

Note, that's not always engineering, but sometimes it's hard to get product management looking beyond current sales needs, and therefore it does fall on engineering to do the strategic work.

IMO, it doesn't matter who does the strategic work, sales, product management, or engineering, as long as someone is doing it.

Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#39

Post by dsfasfasf »

apapli wrote: post #18

Seriously, this article made front page from someone who openly admits he is not from the software industry yet questions how it operates? Simply put: Software companies aren't all the same. Some sell to consumers (B2C), others to businesses (B2B), and others sell to both. You won't find many B2C companies with sales people, due to the cost of sale outweighing the return from one customer. Oppositely you won't find m…

I think is a great article because it provides the perspective of an "outsider". It was pretty refreshing to read the ideas of somebody trying to get into the software business. What makes it more interesting is that it is a sales person, the type of people that many coders dislike because they kick our butt in, well, selling ourselves.

Many times sales people do better then engineers in a big company because they are better able to impress people and forge political alliances. Note that I also think that a sales person is closely related to a business person. If you've ever been to a large corporation, many times the engineering offices are some of the crappiest while the business offices are some of the nicest.

Re: Why Aren't Salespeople Running Software Companies?

#40

Post by codewright »

chriswilliams wrote: post #27
richardjordan wrote: post #14

We tried this before, as an industry. It didn't work. There's a reason investors pattern match away from sales people as founder & CEO of a startup. Sales people are often too good at selling themselves and not so good at getting product out the door. Selling ahead of the curve right up until the point you've burned your market with missed ship dates. Having done both sales (taken product to market leading position f…

Hey Richard, I disagree. "Lean startup" (I've only skimmed, not read) is all about teaching coders to sell. Correct me if I'm wrong, no code should be written unless there is market demand. The challenge is not selling ONCE you have a solid product, it's going from NOTHING to something. Chris

You haven't read "Lean Startup" yet you're leaning on it as a source of authority?

And you sign your comments as if we can't see your bloody username?

I have read Lean Startup and guided the development of products based on it so let me tell what (some of) Lean Startup says:

1. Make the simplest possible thing that could validate your hypothesis (a well formed one) against the market.

2. Use real data and principled hypotheses backed by data to guide product iteration once you've established a market response to one of your MVPs.

The key part being here - MAKING the thing.

What the book doesn't say is, "sell ice to eskimos, hire outsourced coders, hope for the best".

I've worked at startups dictated by salespeople or their sales process, it was a goddamn mess.

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