You know, Google, the web already had this feature • Hacker News Board

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#161

Post by notatoad » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 1:43 AM UTC

MatthewPhillips wrote: post #144

mythz wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google, more than any other company, has made the web a better place. The web was horrible dumping ground before Google - laced with Portals and flashing display ads, pathetic Search, fragmented content. Chrome's the best browser, Gmail the best Email client, Google Maps / Earth the best mapping client, there's only 1 YouTube, the Mobile landscape would be a walled garden with every user a hostage if it wasn't for An…

I disagree, the web of the 90s was really awesome. I remember one of the first things I did when I got online was look up Star Wars websites (using Webcrawler). There were dozens of sites, all made by fans, all amateur, all full of cheesy graphics, .wav sounds, but all unique. Here's the Google results for "Star wars". Tell me when you get to a result that wasn't created by a corporation: https://www.google.com/q=sta…

The web of the 90s was an awesome exclusive subculture. The web google has been promoting is inclusive and egalitarian. It isn't just for nerds, and cares about things other than Star Wars.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#162

Post by thisisrobv » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 1:47 AM UTC

3825 wrote: post #133

kunai wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then stop using their products. Switch to bing, switch to Internet Explorer, get an iPhone and shut up about it. I use Yahoo (flame me all you want), I use Firefox, and I do own an iPhone. But I am not going to shut up about it, because Google is forcing me away even though they're the best at what they do. I hate them because I care.

>I hate them because I care. I am sorry but I can't understand your rationale. Please elaborate? What do you care about and what do you hate? Do you care about Google as a publicly shared company and hate the lack of focus in the growing company? Do you care about the web and hate the growth of walled gardens? >Google is forcing me away even though they're the best at what they do What specifically bothers you? If th…

Google has done an amazing job of mixing really shitty practices like this with really amazing things like the self driving car and glass.

As long as they continue to diversify and innovate they will have supporters... even if they often break their "don't be evil" motto.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#163

Post by ender7 » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 1:51 AM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #151

blhack wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Google has overstayed the web's welcome. Then stop using their products. Switch to bing, switch to Internet Explorer, get an iPhone and shut up about it. No, google has not "overstayed the web's welcome", google has overstayed the welcome of a few entitled silicon valley golddiggers who will continue feeling wronged for the next 10 minutes until they realize what wonderful things google has created in the world for…

> Then stop using their products. Switch to bing, switch to Internet Explorer, get an iPhone and shut up about it. And who exactly are you to tell him to "shut up about it"? He made his case. You might disagree. State your case and let the discussion continue. Anything else --like telling him to "shup up"-- should be beneath HN standards. For one, people do use alternative products. It's not as if Chrome is the ultim…

I don't know, he/she didn't really "make a case". Read it again -- the OP doesn't actually say anything in the grandparent post besides "they used to be great, but now I hate them". Why does the OP hate them? Who knows!

The fact that such a contentless diatribe is at #1 is depressing. That too should be beneath HN's standards.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#164

Post by WayneDB » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 1:57 AM UTC

mythz wrote: post #132

kunai wrote: post #2

Google has overstayed the web's welcome. What started out as a quirky, innovative company that bucked all of the suit-and-tie trends (see Microsoft, HP, even Apple in some regards) of Silicon Valley, has now turned into a monstrous calamity with no regard for its users. Up until 2009, it was breezy and beautiful, but right now, at this moment, it's a different story altogether. Don't be evil? Pfeh. The only thing lef…

Google, more than any other company, has made the web a better place. The web was horrible dumping ground before Google - laced with Portals and flashing display ads, pathetic Search, fragmented content. Chrome's the best browser, Gmail the best Email client, Google Maps / Earth the best mapping client, there's only 1 YouTube, the Mobile landscape would be a walled garden with every user a hostage if it wasn't for An…

In your opinion. In my opinon the Gmail web client is a disgusting mess of anti-usability and Chrome is arguably not "the best". Webkit is the best - Chrome is a good browser, but empirically - not - the best for ever type of user. Google Maps / Earth may be the best overall free mapping solution for consumers, but it's certainly not the best for all mapping needs. The client applications are somewhat anaemic.

Youtube - Other than the fact that Youtube hosts all the videos - the overall user experience really, really sucks in my opinion. It never remembers settings, you can't disable autoplay and now they're trying to force everybody to use a real-name Google account to view mature content. Totally lame. I truly hope something better comes along.

I agree with the general sentiment of this article though - that Google was awesome because they were so simple and useful and now they're less awesome because they're pushing this agenda of Google Everything and Everything Online which is annoying to many of us.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#165

Post by yabatopia » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 1:57 AM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #155

mythz wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google, more than any other company, has made the web a better place. The web was horrible dumping ground before Google - laced with Portals and flashing display ads, pathetic Search, fragmented content. Chrome's the best browser, Gmail the best Email client, Google Maps / Earth the best mapping client, there's only 1 YouTube, the Mobile landscape would be a walled garden with every user a hostage if it wasn't for An…

> Google, more than any other company, has made the web a better place. The web was horrible dumping ground before Google - laced with Portals and flashing display ads, pathetic Search, fragmented content. Perhaps you have not been around in the nineties / early 00, but the web was far more exciting and cool that the corporate BS that it is today. And YouTube was acquired, it wasn't Google's. Same with Google Earth /…

I agree. I miss the web of the nineties. Fan pages made by amateurs, crazy color combinations, under construction gifs, minimal ads (just a simple banner), no tracking into oblivion. But most of all the vibrant feel, the helpfullness and the innocence. It was a cozy place.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#166

Post by e12e » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 1:58 AM UTC

robryan wrote: post #80

ianstormtaylor wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Normal users don't care about things like "privacy" ... This is not true. If you explained exactly what the extension was doing to a normal user I can almost guarantee they wouldn't like it. No one wants every website they visit to be looked at by an external source. The problem is it's not obvious this is happening. Hell, I'm a web developer and even I wouldn't have thought twice about how Google was displaying th…

Wouldn't my ISP also be recording this information? Your non https browsing is also being sent through countless routers you have no control over. Hell even Google is already tracking you through GA, the +1 button and Adsense. And if you are using Chrome everything you type in the search bar is being sent to power autocomplete.

  > Wouldn't my ISP also be recording this information?

In most countries your ISP would not be allowed to log that information, except for a) billing purposes, or b) in conjunction with the new spying laws. Even then, only traffic information is stored, only for the purpose of surrendering it after law enforcement produces a warrant, and it can only be stored for a limited time (3 or 6 months).

This isn't very nice either -- but most places there are some very strict laws on storing, and using communication data.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#167

Post by AnthonyMouse » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 2:02 AM UTC

sixish wrote: post #98

InclinedPlane wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest problem with Google has been that they've been a "benevolent monarch", more or less. Meaning, much of the reason why google has been good for the web has been due to specific choices that google leadership has made and the ways that google has chosen to wield its power. This contrasts to strict limits on power and strong external forces from competition, etc. As long as the monarch is benevolent this is g…

Google's character was obvious to me when they insisted their slogan was "don't be evil" and not "do no evil". A "do no evil" pledge is something that can be judged. Did they do evil by sabotaging the local 'yellow pages' in Africa? Was using their position on the board of competitors for their own advantage evil? This phrase refers to events and actions and facts, things that accountability is based on. Something ca…

>"don't be evil" is an accountability dodge.

This is really, thoroughly missing the point. There was never anybody to enforce "don't be evil" -- if they had made it "do no evil" then there would still be no one to enforce it. It's a goal, not a law. If Google violates "don't be evil" then nothing happens differently than if they had never adopted it.

The point of "don't be evil" is to remind Google employees which end is up. It's something they can point to when someone else wants them to Do The Wrong Thing, as an official justification for refusing. If you think that means they're going to adhere to it in 100% of cases then you're liable to be disappointed, but I expect we're all still better off that they try most of the time than if they were to just throw it away and become comic book super-villains.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#168

Post by DanBC » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 2:03 AM UTC

yabatopia wrote: post #165

coldtea wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google, more than any other company, has made the web a better place. The web was horrible dumping ground before Google - laced with Portals and flashing display ads, pathetic Search, fragmented content. Perhaps you have not been around in the nineties / early 00, but the web was far more exciting and cool that the corporate BS that it is today. And YouTube was acquired, it wasn't Google's. Same with Google Earth /…

I agree. I miss the web of the nineties. Fan pages made by amateurs, crazy color combinations, under construction gifs, minimal ads (just a simple banner), no tracking into oblivion. But most of all the vibrant feel, the helpfullness and the innocence. It was a cozy place.

...and when you searched for "widgets" you'd find a person a thousand miles away who knew about as much as there possibly is to know about widgets, and they had a little website with all the information. Maybe they were a bus driver, or maybe a professor, but they loved widgets and shared that with you.

Now? "Buy WIDGETS with Amazon".

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#169

Post by turing » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 2:04 AM UTC

kaoD wrote: post #110

dannyr wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried using Facebook and it wants me to create a Profile! I want to post a tweet but Twitter wants me to create a Profile!

I already have a profile both for Google Play and for YouTube. They want me to sign to a different service. "I want to post a tweet but Twitter wants me to open a bank account!" Your argument is invalid. Also: they wouldn't be nagging me if I had no account. Did they nag you when using YouTube while logged out? They don't nag me when I'm not logged in.

Google's argument is that they aren't different services, they are all 'just Google'. Say what you want about that philosophy, but it has worked well for many people, myself included.

Re: You know, Google, the web already had this feature

#170

Post by sshumaker » Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 2:05 AM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #157

sshumaker wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're fixating on Google+ as a social network, when that's not really the point. Google+ is meant to serve as an identity layer for Google, so you don't have a bunch of different logins / passwords to silo-ed properties, which makes a frustrating user experience. They give you pretty damn good tools for deciding what parts of the identity are shared for this exact reason. You can enable Google+ and basically…

> I think you're fixating on Google+ as a social network, when that's not really the point. Google+ is meant to serve as an identity layer for Google, so you don't have a bunch of different logins / passwords to silo-ed properties, which makes a frustrating user experience. No, it's not meant like that at all. Google didn't create Google+ to have a single sign on. It created it specifically to compete with Facebook.…

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57413309-93/larry-page-goog...

"[Larry Page] ... called [G+] the "social spine," reminding listeners that the service isn't just a destination, but a unifying social framework for all Google's products."

First off, Google allows you to have multiple identities with SSO. And I find it hard to argue that it's not a good thing for 99% of the user base. Managing multiple accounts sucks, and being able to share between them (and supporting a very rich set of privacy tools) is a win for most users.

A genuine question: Why don't you want your YouTube account linked to your Gmail?