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PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

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Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#21
post #3

There was a time when I would have felt seriously behind the times using my 3.5 year old PC. Maybe I just have different priorities now, but I no longer feel any compulsion to upgrade. I'm not aware of anything that a new PC can do that my current one can't, besides an incremental, barely noticeable speed bump. On a related note, am I right in thinking that we are currently in the longest ever gap between new HD capa…

An SSD is a fantastic upgrade. If you already have one you're all good.

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#22
> Yet it's still too early to write the PC’s epitaph. It will take another year or so to see whether Windows 8 is accepted by business users, who drive most PC sales.

I don't think so. Not unless business decides it wants random coloured squares combined with mad inefficiency...

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#23
I just got a new desktop this month - faster CPU, more ram, SSD, etc - it really is a lot faster than my 3 year old one. So I don't think hardware improvements are an issue, computer speed is still increasing heavily, and dropping compile time and allowing more programs open at once is always great.

However, since I built the PC myself, I could choose what OS to install, and I'm using Linux and Win7. If I was a more regular user, I'd be forced to use Win8 - and if that was the case, I would not have upgraded. If this is true for other users, then it's clear to me that Windows 8 really is to blame here. I would certainly not purchase a computer running Windows 8 for desktop work, and I believe a majority of desktop users agree with me.

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#24

Bah, PC makers have done this to themselves. Look at their starting lineup...compare it to your average tablet. The tablet is, surprisingly, a better experience. Why? Because it has a solid state drive. It's kind of like what would happen to Porsche / BMW / Mercedes-Benz if a car maker came along that offered an electric sports car for $20K that performed like their $70K offerings. No one wants to buy a $50K BMW that…

At the consumer level the cheap laptops and desktop PCs in shops make a big point about the capacity of their hard drives. 500Gb bottom end, 1Tb more common. I'm assuming it is the 'bigger number looks better' pitch. They even have little labels saying how many songs/pictures/videos you can fit on the disc.

Anyone done research on how much storage is actually used? I've never filled a hard drive yet but I'm old school with music.

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main speed increases as of late have been in CPUs adding more cores, most apps people use don't take advantage of all the available threads. Here I have a top of the line i7 3770k, a Samsung 840 Pro SSD, 16GB of RAM and Firefox will freeze up maxing out on 11% CPU usage and 3.5GB of RAM. I do use some apps that take more advantage of my hardware but most of the time all that horse power does me zero good. Most co…

simply upgrading to SSD is a huge performance booster. if i were still in IT, I would migrate all PCs to SSD, and that's it.

Simply upgrading to SSDs is also a huge financial drain. It's a difference of about $1/Gb for SSDs vs $0.05/Gb for HDDs. For consumers, an SSD could easily cost more than the rest of the PC.

Not saying it's a bad idea mind you, it's just another factor to take into consideration.

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#26
Purely anecdotal, but I'm currently in the market to replace my now 4 year old laptop. My problem? The top of the line laptops do not have touch screens. If I want to have a touch screen I have to settle for compromises elsewhere. It seems, a high resolution touch screen is a hard thing to do. If I buy a laptop now I will actually have to accept a downgrade over my 4 year old laptop. Even if it's not a real issue, psychologically that is very hard to do. So I wait. I think a lot of other people are waiting too - first they waited for RT, then they waited for the Surface Pro, and now we're all waiting for better laptops.

I think this is only one factor that's problematic for Win8. Another is that it now as a touch-first OS, looks and feels like it is competing with the iPad. So perversely, MS may have opened themselves to even worse competition with tablets because they have conflated the desktop and tablet ecosystems together. Instead of people buying a laptop when they need laptop and a tablet when they need a tablet, MS seems to be saying "Hey, you think you need a laptop, but maybe you actually need a tablet?". This is so confusing. People don't know what Windows really is any more. So they either wait, or they buy the less confusing option, which turns out to be the tablet.

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#27
Ignoring the banking issues that have dominated the economy in recent years, I largely associate the decline in PC sales with increasing copyright enforcement, DRM, etc.

In particular, I find it interesting that XP hung on so long and was the one that MS started its Geniune Advantage program with. I suspect it's the first one that many people paid for (to shut up GA) and they felt more ownership of, and commitment to, making it a harder sell for them to upgrade. For better or worse, in earlier years, Microsoft did not really prioritize copyright enforcement as much as they do today. In fact, Gates is on record over this. In 2007, Bill Gates said in Fortune Magazine "It's easier for our software to compete with Linux when there's piracy than when there's not." A year earlier he said "as long as they're going to steal it, we want them to steal ours. They'll get sort of addicted, and then we'll somehow figure out how to collect sometime in the next decade." (LA Times) I think the strong change from the lax enforcement approach in the late 90s and early 2000s (before the XP GA stuff) is a major source of Microsoft's decline in sales. Their OS sales 15 years ago, IMHO, benefited greatly from social effects and word of mouth. I'm sure I'll get some flack for that sentiment, but they deliberately worked to eliminated that effect and now people, at their request, are treating software more like a valuable asset -- and hanging onto what they bought for much longer.

It doesn't help that Vista was poorly received, nor does it help that tablets are filling a lot of the appliance use-cases (video chat, YouTube - another nightmare for copyright - and pocket gaming), and it certainly doesn't help that Windows 8 is also launching like a lead balloon. People never like change. But tablets are still benefiting from the "cool new thing" network effect that has largely left PCs over the past decade, usurped largely by Apple, proving that it hasn't gone away.

People aren't interested in having a better PC than their neighbor any more though because, due largely to copyright enforcement and DRM, they feel less welcomed/excited by the PC+Internet environment and, to top it off, they are already putting their "bling" money into tablets smartphones, etc.

The last time PC sales tanked like this was in 2001, after the IT bubble burst (interestingly, Napster was shut down in July 2001). If we ignore that as an oddball (but one that's consistent with my assertion), from the early 90s to the time of Genuine Advantage, things were lined up very well for the PC market to see strong growth: copyright law was ambiguous or unenforced, and people were actually enjoying buying PCs because they could do new/exciting things every day (music, movies, games, and sharing over the internet) in spite of the specter of copyright litigation. Furthermore, desktops and laptops (full systems, allowing even the OS to change) were the only game in town - so it was the thing being talked about around the water cooler (today it's the tablet, etc).

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#28

Is this a satire? I find it hard to believe that Microsoft and Windows 8 is to solely blame for any decline in PC sales. Haven't PC sales been declining for some time now? This sounds like a pretty far-fetched claim to make here. Considering here in Australia you can still buy a new PC with Windows 7 installed, I find it hard to believe that consumers are opting not to buy a computer just because of Windows 8 comes p…

It's perfectly reasonable. Yes, it may seem that Windows 8 isn't "that bad", but it does have a very real impact on the market. I've seen it with my own eyes. Of all of the people I know across all levels of technical sophistication very, very few of them are enthused about Windows 8 and many of them are actively turned off by it.

More so, while PC sales in general are also under assault from competing devices (like tablets and smartphones), that actually raises the importance of the desirability of the current version of Windows. It's when sales are weak and competition is strong that the effects of an undesirable OS are most pronounced.

Also, PCs certainly aren't going to "disappear" but the rate at which new PCs are purchased, especially in the near term, and the total size of the PC market is still up in the air, by a huge margin and perhaps even by an order of magnitude.

Re: PC sales plunge, Microsoft and Windows 8 blamed

#29
post #26

Purely anecdotal, but I'm currently in the market to replace my now 4 year old laptop. My problem? The top of the line laptops do not have touch screens. If I want to have a touch screen I have to settle for compromises elsewhere. It seems, a high resolution touch screen is a hard thing to do. If I buy a laptop now I will actually have to accept a downgrade over my 4 year old laptop. Even if it's not a real issue, ps…

Not only that, it's hard to find a decent high-performance laptop that has a decent screen. If I were to upgrade now I might think of going with the Lenovo T430u, except it has a 720p 16:9 TN screen. How long until it's possible to buy an ultrabook with a 1080p or higher resolution IPS display? And hoping for a 16:10 aspect ratio is probably out of the question.
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