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IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

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Re: IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

#3
This statement: "Newly disclosed documents prepared by IRS lawyers says that Americans enjoy 'generally no privacy' in their e-mail, Facebook chats, Twitter direct messages, and similar online communications" is entirely consistent with the existence of Warshack. Warshack covers the Sixth Circuit, which includes the following states: Kentucky, Michigan, Ohio, and Tennessee. The IRS is bound by this precedent in those states and nowhere else. Other circuits might find this precedent persuasive and agree in future cases, and that is something the IRS will have to deal with in future prosecutions, but for a Handbook on the law as it stands now, this statement is absolutely accurate.

The nation-wide precedent is they can access anything older than 180 days without a warrant, which for IRS's purposes is basically anything that would be relevant to a criminal tax prosecution (there is no statute of limitations on willful tax evasion or fraud).

Should we have privacy rights in our e-mails and personal messages? I think so. But the Constitution doesn't protect that, any more than it protects "one's papers" if those papers are left on the premises of a third party.[1] Not everything that is a good idea must be necessitated by the Constitution.

[1] Wikipedia's article on "expectation of privacy" is pretty good: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expectation_of_privacy ("In general, one cannot have a reasonable expectation of privacy in things held out to the public."). If you understand how SMTP works, it's hard to argue that it's a private means of communication. You send a clear-text message to a publically-accessible service that is empowered to forward the message to other publically-accessible servers if necessary.

Re: IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

#4
post #3

This statement: "Newly disclosed documents prepared by IRS lawyers says that Americans enjoy 'generally no privacy' in their e-mail, Facebook chats, Twitter direct messages, and similar online communications" is entirely consistent with the existence of Warshack. Warshack covers the Sixth Circuit, which includes the following states: Kentucky, Michigan, Ohio, and Tennessee. The IRS is bound by this precedent in those…

Can they access mail without a warrant that is older than 180 days? If not how the hell is that e-mail law constitutional?

Re: IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

#5
post #4
post #3

This statement: "Newly disclosed documents prepared by IRS lawyers says that Americans enjoy 'generally no privacy' in their e-mail, Facebook chats, Twitter direct messages, and similar online communications" is entirely consistent with the existence of Warshack. Warshack covers the Sixth Circuit, which includes the following states: Kentucky, Michigan, Ohio, and Tennessee. The IRS is bound by this precedent in those…

Can they access mail without a warrant that is older than 180 days? If not how the hell is that e-mail law constitutional?

The EFF has a good page on the principles underlying "reasonable expectation of privacy." See: https://ssd.eff.org/your-computer/govt/privacy.

The crux of the matter is "knowing exposure to third parties." So you have an expectation of privacy in sealed postal mail, but not say post cards or anything printed on the outside of envelopes. While a postal service as a matter of course can't read what's in peoples' sealed letter mail, e-mail is sent in plain text and can be seen by any intermediary SMTP server as well as system administrators of the sending and target mail servers. That's just the nature of the protocol.

Moreover, the fact that the U.S. Postal Service is an agency of the government puts it under heightened scrutiny as compared to e-mail providers who are private parties. The fact that people would be horrified if the U.S. Postal Service were tearing open envelopes and scanning mail to send targeted catalogs, etc, to people but accept Google, etc, doing the same thing as a matter of course really cuts at the knees of the argument that people have the same "expectation of privacy" in their e-mail as they do their letter mail.

Re: IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

#6
post #5
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can they access mail without a warrant that is older than 180 days? If not how the hell is that e-mail law constitutional?

The EFF has a good page on the principles underlying "reasonable expectation of privacy." See: https://ssd.eff.org/your-computer/govt/privacy . The crux of the matter is "knowing exposure to third parties." So you have an expectation of privacy in sealed postal mail, but not say post cards or anything printed on the outside of envelopes. While a postal service as a matter of course can't read what's in peoples' seale…

But now that gmail has ssl access, this is no longer true, right?

Re: IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

#7
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EFF has a good page on the principles underlying "reasonable expectation of privacy." See: https://ssd.eff.org/your-computer/govt/privacy . The crux of the matter is "knowing exposure to third parties." So you have an expectation of privacy in sealed postal mail, but not say post cards or anything printed on the outside of envelopes. While a postal service as a matter of course can't read what's in peoples' seale…

But now that gmail has ssl access, this is no longer true, right?

Gmail has SSL to Google's e-mail server. If you e.g. send a mail to someone using Outlook, it's sent in clear text. And at both ends it's scanned to deliver everyone involved targeted advertising.

"Reasonable expectation of privacy" doesn't have an implicit "only as against the government." If you're knowingly exposing the contents to Google and Microsoft to scan, you can't claim to have a "reasonable expectation of privacy" in the contents.

Re: IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

#10
post #3

This statement: "Newly disclosed documents prepared by IRS lawyers says that Americans enjoy 'generally no privacy' in their e-mail, Facebook chats, Twitter direct messages, and similar online communications" is entirely consistent with the existence of Warshack. Warshack covers the Sixth Circuit, which includes the following states: Kentucky, Michigan, Ohio, and Tennessee. The IRS is bound by this precedent in those…

I understand how IMAPS, SMTPS, and SSL work. Not clear text...
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