From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater • Hacker News Board

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#11

Post by ultimoo » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 6:36 PM UTC

jmduke wrote: post #8

I always chuckle when I hear "MVP" in the same sentence as a RoR/node.js stack, complicated monetization strategies and A/B testing. A bank account and a Google Docs spreadsheet. That's MVP.

Bang on. I would probably extend it to include the email-first startup strategy that was posted here by Sachin of Posterous fame a while ago. Since ZeroCater provides a physical service to companies and is located in SF Bay Area with a uniquely high density of companies it probably doesn’t apply here, but I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs.

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#12

Post by alaskamiller » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 6:37 PM UTC

ultimoo wrote: post #6

justin wrote: post #3

Arram followed the advice I normally give people applying to startups for non-technical jobs that have no relevant experience: he prepared tremendously for his interview and actually came with real suggestions on things we should do, and visualized himself in the position. On paper, he wasn't someone we would have considered (his previous experience was as a security guard and ice cream scooper with no college degree…

Reading inspiring stories like this makes me realize how much of entrepreneurship is about taking risks rather than hard work. Moving to another place with a few thousand dollars in your pocket, quitting a stable job without a firm idea in mind, figuring things out as you go. There may have been dozens of well prepared and hard working candidates available that day, but probably none were out of job and interviewing…

You're first step is to switch mindsets.

You see it as taking risks versus hard work, then placing value on them.

I see taking risk just hard work. Just $500 left in my checking account? Work harder. No college degree? Work harder. Work hard to be able to take risks.

Everything else will be crystal clear thereafter.

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#13

Post by patio11 » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 6:51 PM UTC

ultimoo wrote: post #11

jmduke wrote: post #8

I always chuckle when I hear "MVP" in the same sentence as a RoR/node.js stack, complicated monetization strategies and A/B testing. A bank account and a Google Docs spreadsheet. That's MVP.

Bang on. I would probably extend it to include the email-first startup strategy that was posted here by Sachin of Posterous fame a while ago. Since ZeroCater provides a physical service to companies and is located in SF Bay Area with a uniquely high density of companies it probably doesn’t apply here, but I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs.

I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs

Believe it or not, services businesses did actually exist before CRM software and online signup forms. The SF Bay Area does not have a uniquely high density of companies. You can totally do spiritually-similar things to this.

A spiritually similar example: Appointment Reminder didn't actually exist in summer 2010, but I had a two-page demo of it set up. I got $400 out of an ATM when I went home to Chicago to visit, and just wandered around the Gold Coast/Magnificent Mile region of the city looking for every hair salon and massage therapy practice I could find. I asked them all if I they took walk-ins and, if so, could I have 30 minutes of the owner's time for whatever the rate was ($30 or so). In lieu of the shoulder massage/etc, I said "I'm interested in the massage therapy industry. Would you mind if we just chatted for half an hour about it?" And I asked about how they handled scheduling, appointments, no-shows, etc etc. I also did a demo of my two-page AR mini-app on the iPad and asked if they would be interested in buying it when it was ready.

I think only one person actually accepted my money for the interviews. I got five-ish "Please tell me when that is ready" out of a dozen or so conversations. No Bay Area or signup form required. (I put their emails in a paper notebook. And lost it prior to launch. Whoopsie.)

This was mostly successful for me: it confirmed that there was a market willing to pay for AR without me needing to actually build it to demonstrate that. (My sampling technique, which found only massage therapists/hair salons, did sort of lead me off the rails as to who I'd eventually end up targeting for most of the business. D'oh.)

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#14

Post by ultimoo » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 6:57 PM UTC

patio11 wrote: post #13

ultimoo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bang on. I would probably extend it to include the email-first startup strategy that was posted here by Sachin of Posterous fame a while ago. Since ZeroCater provides a physical service to companies and is located in SF Bay Area with a uniquely high density of companies it probably doesn’t apply here, but I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs.

I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs Believe it or not, services businesses did actually exist before CRM software and online signup forms. The SF Bay Area does not have a uniquely high density of companies. You can totally do spiritually-similar things to this. A spiritually similar example: Appointment Reminder didn't actually exist in summer 2010, but I had a two-page demo of…

Haha, great story, thanks for sharing the walk-in appointment idea. Sorry about your notebook though. This does change how I used to think about validating ideas. Email signups and fancy landing pages can be replaced by personally going over, handing out business cards, and pitching your ideas whenever you get a chance like it says in the original post.

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#15

Post by _lex » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 7:00 PM UTC

justin wrote: post #3

Arram followed the advice I normally give people applying to startups for non-technical jobs that have no relevant experience: he prepared tremendously for his interview and actually came with real suggestions on things we should do, and visualized himself in the position. On paper, he wasn't someone we would have considered (his previous experience was as a security guard and ice cream scooper with no college degree…

When you had him book orders for your friends, did you see it as a business opportunity, or just a problem that needed solving?

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#16

Post by DanielBMarkham » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 7:09 PM UTC

patio11 wrote: post #13

ultimoo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bang on. I would probably extend it to include the email-first startup strategy that was posted here by Sachin of Posterous fame a while ago. Since ZeroCater provides a physical service to companies and is located in SF Bay Area with a uniquely high density of companies it probably doesn’t apply here, but I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs.

I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs Believe it or not, services businesses did actually exist before CRM software and online signup forms. The SF Bay Area does not have a uniquely high density of companies. You can totally do spiritually-similar things to this. A spiritually similar example: Appointment Reminder didn't actually exist in summer 2010, but I had a two-page demo of…

Amazing the amount of useful information you can get just walking around town talking to people :)

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#17

Post by beachstartup » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 7:13 PM UTC

ultimoo wrote: post #6

justin wrote: post #3

Arram followed the advice I normally give people applying to startups for non-technical jobs that have no relevant experience: he prepared tremendously for his interview and actually came with real suggestions on things we should do, and visualized himself in the position. On paper, he wasn't someone we would have considered (his previous experience was as a security guard and ice cream scooper with no college degree…

Reading inspiring stories like this makes me realize how much of entrepreneurship is about taking risks rather than hard work. Moving to another place with a few thousand dollars in your pocket, quitting a stable job without a firm idea in mind, figuring things out as you go. There may have been dozens of well prepared and hard working candidates available that day, but probably none were out of job and interviewing…

> taking risks rather than hard work.

it's both. and appetite for risk is not the belief that nothing bad will happen, it's the belief that you will be able to handle anything that happens, no matter how bad. it's being at peace with the fact that bad things will happen.

most people live their entire lives trying to avoid bad situations that don't exist in reality, but rather live in their imaginations. in my opinion they are completely delusional.

a lot of entrepreneurs have been totally broke or were poor in the past - in my mind, this is what allows them to continually take risks. they know exactly what it's like being broke and struggling, it's not a mystery. it has no power over them. they simply don't care if they end up going broke. they know what it is, and how to climb back out.

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#18

Post by dpiers » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 7:16 PM UTC

tansey wrote: post #10

I've heard some pretty terrible stories about the vegetarian options offered by ZeroCater. It seems that many times they give the omnivores a full meal and then the vegetarian meal is the same meal without the meat, meaning it contains virtually no protein. I'm not a vegetarian, but I am sensitive to other people's preferences. Has the situation changed lately?

I am the lead developer at ZeroCater, was a vegetarian for 3 of the last 4 years, and I can honestly say I that never had access to vegetarian lunch options remotely close to the variety and quality we provide to our clients.

We currently offer 4335 vegetarian options from 190 vendors, ranging from a Quinoa Salad with Green Apple, Crumbled Gorgonzola Blue Cheese, Candied Walnut and Organic Baby Spinach to a Roasted Pepper and Mushroom Calzone or Green Chile Mac & Cheese.

Our most common complaint from vegetarians isn't the lack of options; it's that the omnivores took all of the vegetarian food before they got to it.

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#19

Post by SatvikBeri » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 7:16 PM UTC

patio11 wrote: post #13

ultimoo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bang on. I would probably extend it to include the email-first startup strategy that was posted here by Sachin of Posterous fame a while ago. Since ZeroCater provides a physical service to companies and is located in SF Bay Area with a uniquely high density of companies it probably doesn’t apply here, but I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs.

I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs Believe it or not, services businesses did actually exist before CRM software and online signup forms. The SF Bay Area does not have a uniquely high density of companies. You can totally do spiritually-similar things to this. A spiritually similar example: Appointment Reminder didn't actually exist in summer 2010, but I had a two-page demo of…

Who did you end up targeting?

Re: From Selling Scoops of Ice Cream to Founding ZeroCater

#20

Post by patio11 » Mon, Apr 08, 2013, 7:22 PM UTC

SatvikBeri wrote: post #19

patio11 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can imagine some form of a computerized sign up is needed for other MVPs Believe it or not, services businesses did actually exist before CRM software and online signup forms. The SF Bay Area does not have a uniquely high density of companies. You can totally do spiritually-similar things to this. A spiritually similar example: Appointment Reminder didn't actually exist in summer 2010, but I had a two-page demo of…

Who did you end up targeting?

That's a long story. Suffice it to say that I have more exterminators as clients than massage therapists -- apparently when a client forgetting an appointment means your three employees just drove 45 minutes to get locked out of a house that irks (and costs) more than just having to play Angry Birds until you get a walk-in.