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The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

theatlantic.com

11–20 of 87 posts

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#11
I watched a very good series recently called "The Ascent of Money", offers many good insights into these matters. It's available in full on youtube for those interested.

Ultimately though, all talk of policy is a fools errand and utterly useless unless the overarching corruption in our political system is addressed. The free market dictates that companies can be expected to maximize their profits by whatever means necessary, and it's up to government to make sure "whatever means necessary" stays within an acceptable domain that protects key public interests. The primary requisite for the advancement of any civilization is it's resistance to corruption, and nothing short of a total overhaul will even put a dent on the decline we're experiencing. Until the era of pay-for-play and superPACS is brought to an end, legislation will always mold itself to induce the greatest profits for big corporations at the expense of every other interest.

EDIT: I should add as well though that the other side of this coin is that we as consumers CAN have a great influence outside of politics by voting with our dollars. If everyone refused to buy cheap Chinese goods and boycott Wal-Mart, enacting protectionist policies to protect American manufacturing wouldn't even be necessary. If we refused to put our money in banks involved in scandals or do business with their partners they'd soon be out of business. Alas, there in lies the other doom of the free market; as consumers we can be expected to act exactly in our own interests, which dictates buying the cheapest goods and most attractive deals regardless of the greater effects. There has to be a mass change in psychology, a great awakening. Hmm, good start up idea???!!

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#12
post #3

Yup. Using humans to get stuff done isn't our only option anymore, so a difference between the stock market and labor market isn't surprising. I live in a liberal area and I'm facebook friends with a lot of Burners (people who have gone to burning man). I see a ton of image macros and posts where people are implying that it's a moral wrong that businesses are doing well while we have high unemployment. :-/ For me, on…

What is morally wrong is the idea that everyone should have a job in a society where it's so obviously unnecessary for everyone to work, and where the level of productivity is in fact detrimental to the people and their environment in the long term.

What I'm saying is that we should get rid of the idea of not having a wage job at all as inherently less respectable than working with anything and introduce a guaranteed minimum income.

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#14

From the comments: "The focus and concern shouldn't be how much the top 1% are making, it should be how much the 99% are making, especially the bottom 50%. I dont really care how much money Bill Gates and Donald Trump are making. Their income has absolutely no effect at all on my income, what I'm most concerned about is how much money I'm making. The economy is not a zero sum game, where if the rich make a trillion m…

Edit: nope, I'm silly.

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#15
Supply and demand.

More people are increasingly willing to give more money to fewer people. The key is WILLING. People CHOOSE to hand over their money. For all the complaints/accusations about unfair business practices etc., fact is people wouldn't be handing all that money to "them" if not for receiving something of equal/greater value in return.

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#16
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the point of the article is that the "Bush cuts" arrived because they promised more and better jobs. Yet 99% of that went to the corporations' own profit and to the top guys there. It kills the illusion that wealth people and corporations are "job creators" so we need to cut their taxes more.

99% is factually false. http://www.policymic.com/articles/3701/who-really-benefited-...

Ignores social security and is thus meaningless.

PS: Millions of 'Disabled' workers benefit from social security which is far more a social program than a retirement program.

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#17
post #14

From the comments: "The focus and concern shouldn't be how much the top 1% are making, it should be how much the 99% are making, especially the bottom 50%. I dont really care how much money Bill Gates and Donald Trump are making. Their income has absolutely no effect at all on my income, what I'm most concerned about is how much money I'm making. The economy is not a zero sum game, where if the rich make a trillion m…

Edit: nope, I'm silly.

It looks like the entire comment is the quote - the only closing " I can see is at the very end.

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#18

From the comments: "The focus and concern shouldn't be how much the top 1% are making, it should be how much the 99% are making, especially the bottom 50%. I dont really care how much money Bill Gates and Donald Trump are making. Their income has absolutely no effect at all on my income, what I'm most concerned about is how much money I'm making. The economy is not a zero sum game, where if the rich make a trillion m…

That comment is missing the fact that IF the top 1% are having huge growth in wealth AND the 99% are having tiny growth then perhaps we could tweak matters so that the growth in wealth, which we can clearly see by examining the whole picture, is not quite so lopsided.

I don't care if there are people with 100's of millions of dollars but when I know their wealth is increasing at very fast rate it makes me think they'll be okay if we 'level' the playing field

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#19
post #17
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Edit: nope, I'm silly.

It looks like the entire comment is the quote - the only closing " I can see is at the very end.

You're right, turns out I am the one jumping to conclusions here. Or, in this case, missing the positioning of a quote mark.

Re: The Stock Market vs. the Labor Market

#20
Don't look at inequality from a justice perspective. Justice is a moral definition, and highly volatile, so the discussion would be endless. Look at it from a society efficiency point of view.

From an efficiency point of view, some inequality is interesting. You need to aggregate some capital for investments to occur, you need rich people for high risk investments to be possible. However, as in most systems, there is an optimum point. Beyond a certain level of inequality, the system becomes less efficient.

Herein lies the problem with the job creators argument. It is not fundamentally wrong, but it is wrong for the current level of inequality. We are past the optimum and, for society and the economy to gain efficiency, inequality must be reduced.

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