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More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

forbes.com

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Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#21

Post by firebug »

menloparkbum wrote: post #17
omnivore wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I certainly didn't tell everyone to create startups. But reading here, that's what it seems like it trends towards. If you're over the age of 27, your example just doesn't count. It's not nearly as easy today to do what you did, than it was a decade ago. The economy has changed dramatically and ancedotal experiences aside, it's hardly a blueprint for mass success. There is no inverse relationship between "hard work"…

It's not nearly as easy today to do what you did, than it was a decade ago It's even easier. Enlightened hiring managers just want to see output: github, websites, blogs, downloadable software, etc. At the startups I've worked for recently we only looked thoroughly at a resume if the person had no online presence (which was already a red flag). Maybe you won't get hired at Google or an investment bank, though.

->"Enlightened hiring managers just want to see output"

From my experience "enlightened hiring managers" are the exception rather than the rule.

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#22

Post by neilk »

modoc wrote: post #9
omnivore wrote: post #3

Aah, more of this madness. The only people who can afford to drop out of college to pursue a startup are those with parents who will subsidize them while they do it, have extensive contacts or those who get very, very lucky. It's just not practical advice and society doesn't treat folks in the status quo particularly well who do so. You might get far, but inevitably you'll get stuck in a rut somewhere along the way,…

I have to disagree with this. I dropped out of college, spent the winter as a snowboard bum in Colorado, moved back to Boston, and started working for minimum wage in retail. Managed to save enough money to buy a new computer. Got a better job, rinse & repeat. At no time was I subsidized by anyone else. I also don't think I was "very very lucky". Sure, I consider myself lucky in general, but the path from dropping ou…

Wow. How do you save anything when working for minimum wage in the USA? In Boston, which is a pretty expensive city?

I don't know the specifics of your situtation, but it seems to me that most "self-made" people had a lot of educational and social capital built up already. They might have taken a year or two voluntarily outside the system, but it was only because, previously their parents were themselves well educated and made enough money to send their kids to good schools and nurture their interests and talents. So while the child may be exceptional and hard-working, and legitimately earned success, it's usually not quite accurate to say there was no support.

Again, I'm not saying this is you, but I see it a lot. I know of maybe one person who overcame a true working class background where their parents actually discouraged them from even going into computers. Everyone else I know in this game is middle class, even upper middle class.

I'm also interested in how much milieu seems to affect outcomes. People who just grew up around independent professionals or entrepreneurs have no trouble visualizing themselves doing that, and they know all the social cues.

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#23

Post by ks »

ojbyrne wrote: post #2

Hmm, that means 80% did start or complete college. Sounds like a no-brainer to me.

And it only says that 80% completed college. It doesn't say how many of the 20% started their college education. Many internet billionaires met in college and dropped out because they had a great idea (of course, most of the other drop outs probably didn't succeed, but that's another story).

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#24

Post by modoc »

neilk wrote: post #22
modoc wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to disagree with this. I dropped out of college, spent the winter as a snowboard bum in Colorado, moved back to Boston, and started working for minimum wage in retail. Managed to save enough money to buy a new computer. Got a better job, rinse & repeat. At no time was I subsidized by anyone else. I also don't think I was "very very lucky". Sure, I consider myself lucky in general, but the path from dropping ou…

Wow. How do you save anything when working for minimum wage in the USA? In Boston, which is a pretty expensive city? I don't know the specifics of your situtation, but it seems to me that most "self-made" people had a lot of educational and social capital built up already. They might have taken a year or two voluntarily outside the system, but it was only because, previously their parents were themselves well educate…

Honestly it wasn't as hard as I thought it would be. I worked at Urban Outfitters for $5.15/hour. I started off sleeping on a friend's couch until I could save up enough to get an apartment. I shared a rough but clean apartment in Oak Square in Brighton with two other guys. It was on a bus line, and I could also bike to work if it wasn't snowy. We paid $300/month each. At my income level I didn't pay any real taxes, so I brought home ~$900/month. Spent $300 on rent, spent about $100 on food, maybe $50 on utilities/laundry, leaving $450 each month for savings. At this point that sounds like nothing, but then I didn't have any real expenses and it adds up month after month.

While I certainly benefited from having good parents, I didn't have the direct financial support the OP referred to. My point being that you can financially bootstrap yourself without rich parents and without looking at college as "free" rent and food.

I agree with you about the support of parents, focus on education, access to computers, visibility to successful people, etc... means a lot. However very little if any of that can fixed by tinkering with higher educational institutions. It's cultural, and it's economic.

While I'd love to see everyone given the same opportunities, support, etc... it's confusing because we can't have everyone working in nice offices making $100k+/year. People still need to work at McDonalds, drive street sweepers, pick up trash, and all the other key roles in our society. Is it "fair" that upper middle class kids have a better chance of being upper middle class themselves? No. Is there a good way to fix that? Not that I know of.

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#25

Post by ks »

meterplech wrote: post #8

I think the idea of dropping out of college fits in with the general startup mold. Startups are disruptive, they do not follow the traditional path of what's out there. Likewise, dropping out of college and leaving that safety net is certainly disruptive. It takes a special kind of person to do that. Also, it is unclear how many of these billionaires came from the world of tech startups, inherently more disruptive th…

"Some of the most common professions among the parents of American billionaires (for whom we could find the information) were engineer, accountant and small-business owner."

It seems to me that most of them had a safety net - their parents.

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#27

Post by gills »

modoc wrote: post #24
neilk wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow. How do you save anything when working for minimum wage in the USA? In Boston, which is a pretty expensive city? I don't know the specifics of your situtation, but it seems to me that most "self-made" people had a lot of educational and social capital built up already. They might have taken a year or two voluntarily outside the system, but it was only because, previously their parents were themselves well educate…

Honestly it wasn't as hard as I thought it would be. I worked at Urban Outfitters for $5.15/hour. I started off sleeping on a friend's couch until I could save up enough to get an apartment. I shared a rough but clean apartment in Oak Square in Brighton with two other guys. It was on a bus line, and I could also bike to work if it wasn't snowy. We paid $300/month each. At my income level I didn't pay any real taxes,…

Do you have a blog or something? It sounds like you have some good stories and lessons to share.

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#28

Post by electromagnetic »

menloparkbum wrote: post #17
omnivore wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I certainly didn't tell everyone to create startups. But reading here, that's what it seems like it trends towards. If you're over the age of 27, your example just doesn't count. It's not nearly as easy today to do what you did, than it was a decade ago. The economy has changed dramatically and ancedotal experiences aside, it's hardly a blueprint for mass success. There is no inverse relationship between "hard work"…

It's not nearly as easy today to do what you did, than it was a decade ago It's even easier. Enlightened hiring managers just want to see output: github, websites, blogs, downloadable software, etc. At the startups I've worked for recently we only looked thoroughly at a resume if the person had no online presence (which was already a red flag). Maybe you won't get hired at Google or an investment bank, though.

I know from personal experience that a journalism degree will get you nowhere fast in the writing world. Some of the top editors screen out candidates by if their degree is anything but a passing mention on their resume, if it's the top thing in your experiences you're rejected.

I got a job at 17 writing reviews, when I left the job (due to the politics of the job) I had more than enough experience to apply for a job for one of the big magazines. What editors are looking for in writers is a great personal voice, which is something journalism classes teach out of you. I have never seen 'journalism degree' listed on any job in journalism, it's simply not wanted.

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#29

Post by blhack »

jrockway wrote: post #7
omnivore wrote: post #3

Aah, more of this madness. The only people who can afford to drop out of college to pursue a startup are those with parents who will subsidize them while they do it, have extensive contacts or those who get very, very lucky. It's just not practical advice and society doesn't treat folks in the status quo particularly well who do so. You might get far, but inevitably you'll get stuck in a rut somewhere along the way,…

I don't really see this as a problem. After college, nobody asks or cares if you went to college. So while you do need to have some skills to get a job, you don't need a piece of paper anymore. (Not in the programming industry, anyway.) If you want to do a startup, spend the 4 years that you would have spent in college learning how to program and making money doing that. Then, you'll be able to support your own start…

I could not agree with you more.

Look, if you can cut it as a programmer you can cut it is a programmer. Start programming, get involved in some OSS projects, get your name out there!

If you really genuinely want to be a "Computer Software Engineer", spend 4 years networking with other engineers and honing in your programming skills, not taking sociology and micro economics.

Re: More than 20% of self-made billionaires never completed college

#30

Post by gills »

ivankirigin wrote: post #26

100% of billionaires are outliers. Try not to extract patterns hoping for repeatable success.

Well said. I would guess (and it's only a guess) that people with the drive to become billionaires would find a way regardless of formal education, and that there is no recipe you can follow to reach an outlier level of wealth.
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