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Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

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Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#61

Post by coldtea »

roel_v wrote: post #42
starik36 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's hilarious. Columbo was my grandfather's favorite show on Hungarian TV back in the day. Every episode was absolutely perfectly lip synced - you couldn't even tell that Hungarian wasn't the original language.

"Every episode was absolutely perfectly lip synced - you couldn't even tell that Hungarian wasn't the original language." OT, but do you know anything about how that worked? Surely in another language, the form of the lips while speaking is different, not to mention the length of sentences, double entendres that are impossible to translate, etc?

>OT, but do you know anything about how that worked?

Well, remember to also take the "absolutely perfectly lip synced" and "couldn't even tell" with a grain of salt.

If we were to see one such lip synced episode now, I bet it would be quite crude and obvious.

It's probably just that being a kid at the time, and remembering it afterwards (maybe with some nostalgia), it appears better than it was.

Here's a Hungarian lip-synced Columbo episode:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzl4b23cZg4

Not "absolutely perfectly lip synced" at all.

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#62

Post by tikwidd »

singular wrote: post #41
rdtsc wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have a clearance you should absolutely not be clicking on it (if you are also paranoid and don't want to possibly fail your polygraph test -- "have you accessed or downloaded classified documents on your personal computer...?" er...oops). Otherwise if you don't hold a clearance, I don't think they can do anything to you (however, I am not a lawyer so don't take this as a legal advice etc etc...)

Actually don't worry too much about the polygraph, it's complete pseudoscience. http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Polygraph

and yet, still used

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#63

Post by stonemetal »

scotty79 wrote: post #57
rdtsc wrote: post #12

Usual disclaimer applies for those with a clearance: by accessing classified documents on your home computers you could get yourself in serious trouble (in theory). In light of this particular situation I don't know if anyone has ever been punished but you should be careful.

Is it still classified if it's public? Doesn't a thing stop being secret automatically when it leaks out? If it does not then I wonder why they even called it "classified" or "secret". They should call it "blargh" and avoid the confusion.

I worked at a defense contractor the last time this happened. There was an email circulated by security to the effect that it didn't matter, it is still considered classified.

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#64

Post by Cacti »

scotty79 wrote: post #57
rdtsc wrote: post #12

Usual disclaimer applies for those with a clearance: by accessing classified documents on your home computers you could get yourself in serious trouble (in theory). In light of this particular situation I don't know if anyone has ever been punished but you should be careful.

Is it still classified if it's public? Doesn't a thing stop being secret automatically when it leaks out? If it does not then I wonder why they even called it "classified" or "secret". They should call it "blargh" and avoid the confusion.

No. Whether something is classified or not has nothing to do with who has read it or whether its common knowledge or leaked or not. Classified is classified until its officially declassified, period.

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#65

Post by sigzero »

scotty79 wrote: post #57
rdtsc wrote: post #12

Usual disclaimer applies for those with a clearance: by accessing classified documents on your home computers you could get yourself in serious trouble (in theory). In light of this particular situation I don't know if anyone has ever been punished but you should be careful.

Is it still classified if it's public? Doesn't a thing stop being secret automatically when it leaks out? If it does not then I wonder why they even called it "classified" or "secret". They should call it "blargh" and avoid the confusion.

There is a specific process to de-classify materials and wikileaks isn't it. It is still classified.

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#66

Post by sigzero »

justincormack wrote: post #36
ewbuoi wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was this released through official channels or leaked? I'm assuming it makes a difference, but I wouldn't know...

"The collection published today has not been leaked. Assange said WikiLeaks had been working for the past year to analyse and assess a vast amount of data held at the U.S. national archives before releasing it in a searchable form." http://leaksource.wordpress.com/2013/04/08/wikileaks-plusd-p... So it is legal

Legal in what sense? Wikileaks cannot de-classify materials regardless of how much they "analyze and assess" it.

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#67

Post by skrebbel »

berntb wrote: post #58
skrebbel wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a common argument, that I've seen at lot here on HN as well. It boils down to "every country should act in only its own direct best interest, and assume that every other country will or should the same". If I'm not mistaken, that's called classical realism[1] by political scientists. Now, why do things have to be this way? Are you certain that, even while we the people are perfectly capable of being nice to e…

>>Now, why do things have to be this way? Are you certain that, even while we the people are perfectly capable of being nice to each other, the countries that represent us must act like immorally self-centered egoists? That is a very common opinion (yes, I'm calling you naive). You are making an analogy between civil society (where people are nice) to states, where there is "realpolitik". You forget that there is a v…

Then explain the EU to me? Especially the beginnings of it? E.g. France, UK and Germany, mortal enemies for centuries, shifting focus from self-interest defense thinking to collaboration?

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#68

Post by olifante »

iand wrote: post #38
rdtsc wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have a clearance you should absolutely not be clicking on it (if you are also paranoid and don't want to possibly fail your polygraph test -- "have you accessed or downloaded classified documents on your personal computer...?" er...oops). Otherwise if you don't hold a clearance, I don't think they can do anything to you (however, I am not a lawyer so don't take this as a legal advice etc etc...)

Makes sense. If you have contractually agreed to preserve state secrets then just avoid this stuff.

Welcome to the future of intelligence agencies. Their employees are legally required to know less than the general public.

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#69

Post by Udo »

tikwidd wrote: post #62
singular wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually don't worry too much about the polygraph, it's complete pseudoscience. http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Polygraph

and yet, still used

They're using the idea of the polygraph, the actual measurements could mean anything. It's the "conversation" during and after the test that counts.

Of course it's also a great medium to screw someone over, but that's a whole other thing.

Re: Wikileaks release "PlusD": Database of 1.7 million diplomatic cables

#70

Post by Udo »

roel_v wrote: post #42
starik36 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's hilarious. Columbo was my grandfather's favorite show on Hungarian TV back in the day. Every episode was absolutely perfectly lip synced - you couldn't even tell that Hungarian wasn't the original language.

"Every episode was absolutely perfectly lip synced - you couldn't even tell that Hungarian wasn't the original language." OT, but do you know anything about how that worked? Surely in another language, the form of the lips while speaking is different, not to mention the length of sentences, double entendres that are impossible to translate, etc?

They still do that in Germany to every foreign language movie or series, to the point where it's impossible to get the original content legally. The sad truth is that although they usually do a good job synching the translation with facial movements, the finer nuances and sometimes the entire point of a scene are lost. On the other hand, they did probably manage to actually improve some very bad source material, but as a rule the quality goes dramatically downhill more often than not. There are also a lot of instances where the translation team didn't seem to completely understand the source material to begin with - it's all quite horrible.
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