The submitted article mentioned an ad describing one prospect as a "brahmin boy." How pervasive is caste as a selection criterion for arranged marriages?
Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
61–70 of 91 posts
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're joking, right? The logical flaw in that question isn't poking you in the eyeball as you type? Whenever a society is permissive of divorce, the divorce rate rises. When a society strongly disapproves of divorce (or makes it legally tough), well, that's another matter. There's a high correlation between societies with arranged marriage traditions and a disapproval of divorce. (A->B not necessarily B->A.)
You're right, but at the same time you are not directly addressing the question: Societies where marriages are based of 'love' have a very high divorce rate. Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process. But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate. What the question really boils down to is this: Are people happier in general in societies with predominantly arranged marriages or in socie…
Well, you're using data that doesn't reduce to what you want it to.
Divorce is only one possible indicator of unhappiness, there are lots of people who are unhappy and do not or cannot divorce.
You also assume that divorce leads to decreased happiness overall and I'm not convinced that's true either.
Moreover, I think it's pretty remarkable that almost 50% of people make a "successful" choice of a life partner. (Exclusively in the sense that they do not divorce.)
Considering how horrible people are at decisionmaking in general, and how vague and slippery the idea of "happiness" is, (see Stumbling on Happiness, and/or Mistakes Were Made for a great layman's overview), it's pretty remarkable... or merely a great indicator of how much people are willing to withstand/fool themselves/constrain their nature.
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#63Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're joking, right? The logical flaw in that question isn't poking you in the eyeball as you type? Whenever a society is permissive of divorce, the divorce rate rises. When a society strongly disapproves of divorce (or makes it legally tough), well, that's another matter. There's a high correlation between societies with arranged marriage traditions and a disapproval of divorce. (A->B not necessarily B->A.)
You're right, but at the same time you are not directly addressing the question: Societies where marriages are based of 'love' have a very high divorce rate. Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process. But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate. What the question really boils down to is this: Are people happier in general in societies with predominantly arranged marriages or in socie…
> Societies where marriages are based of 'love' have a very high divorce rate. Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process. But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate.
Since those exact same societies had a low divorce rate not too long ago, it's unreasonable to blame the high divorce rate on what didn't change between then and now (love-based) and ignore what did change (ease of getting a divorce and stigma).
Yes, US divorce is expensive and can be long, but it is also socially accepted and easy to start. The latter is more relevant than the length and expense of the process because said process keeps itself moving. (The expense and length is also a choice - the choice to fight, which has nothing to do with "ease of divorce" or love vs arranged.)
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#64Or, maybe, here's a radical thought--the next time one of these men meets someone he likes, he could ask her out. The whole arranged marriage nonsense is a blight on the Indian community. Needless to say, it often leads to loveless marriages; further, the fact that you're making life decisions based on scant information results in bizarre situations like the consultant in the article who can't find a wife because the…
I'd have to disagree with this.
The change of a marriage going sour would seem to be almost independent of whether it was arranged or not.
I'm not speaking from experience here, but I would guess any marriage requires a lot of compromise and understanding, regardless of how they came together.
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#65Or, maybe, here's a radical thought--the next time one of these men meets someone he likes, he could ask her out. The whole arranged marriage nonsense is a blight on the Indian community. Needless to say, it often leads to loveless marriages; further, the fact that you're making life decisions based on scant information results in bizarre situations like the consultant in the article who can't find a wife because the…
I think you generalized a lot of things there. I personally am arranged married, and I couldn't be happier. I have a lot of friends who are in the same situation (even ones who are 10+ years into marriage). I also know people who married in 'love' that are not so happy today. Additionally, arranged marriages need not be 'see someone for 10 mins and say yes or no'. There is a large variation in how the whole thing can…
A brief aside: One of my favorite features of the Internet is the disintermediation of anthropologists.
Not that I dislike anthropology. But it's more fun as a game that you can play from home.
I learned what you're saying here from an anthropology anthology in college. But somehow it's a lot more credible coming from an unedited, contemporary person.
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're right, but at the same time you are not directly addressing the question: Societies where marriages are based of 'love' have a very high divorce rate. Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process. But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate. What the question really boils down to is this: Are people happier in general in societies with predominantly arranged marriages or in socie…
> Societies where marriages are based of 'love' have a very high divorce rate. Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process. But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate. Since those exact same societies had a low divorce rate not too long ago, it's unreasonable to blame the high divorce rate on what didn't change between then and now (love-based) and ignore what did change (ease of gett…
But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate.
This is actually a statistical fallacy. The divorce rate is not that high in the United States.
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#67Or, maybe, here's a radical thought--the next time one of these men meets someone he likes, he could ask her out. The whole arranged marriage nonsense is a blight on the Indian community. Needless to say, it often leads to loveless marriages; further, the fact that you're making life decisions based on scant information results in bizarre situations like the consultant in the article who can't find a wife because the…
I think you generalized a lot of things there. I personally am arranged married, and I couldn't be happier. I have a lot of friends who are in the same situation (even ones who are 10+ years into marriage). I also know people who married in 'love' that are not so happy today. Additionally, arranged marriages need not be 'see someone for 10 mins and say yes or no'. There is a large variation in how the whole thing can…
"I think you generalized a lot of things there. I personally am arranged married, and I couldn't be happier. I have a lot of friends who are in the same situation (even ones who are 10+ years into marriage). I also know people who married in 'love' that are not so happy today."
Of course. If you didn't have the choice of who to marry then you resign yourself to the notion. But if you made the decision yourself then you'll always wonder if maybe you could have chosen someone way better for you. There was a TED presentation about this some time ago...
(Not saying it's not possible that the particular arranged marriage may have matched you with the best person for you anyway)
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#68I find it shocking that some Indian men have such attitudes, despite having spent time in places like the US. Given the difficulty in finding matches for Indians abroad, some matchmakers are now charging them more. Mr. Dave of Klassic Match charges a minimum fee of $100, versus $50 for candidates living in India. He charges more for specific requirements. For instance, he says some overseas Indians want a bride who i…
Maybe it's because they've spent time in the US, and absorbed the American idea that You Can Have It All, that some Indian men think it's perfectly reasonable to ask for a wife who is "smart, fluent in English" (i.e., has intelligence and skills enough that she isn't economically dependent on her husband) and "simultaneously, docile in the house" (i.e., willing to put up with her husband's bad behavior).
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#69Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're joking, right? The logical flaw in that question isn't poking you in the eyeball as you type? Whenever a society is permissive of divorce, the divorce rate rises. When a society strongly disapproves of divorce (or makes it legally tough), well, that's another matter. There's a high correlation between societies with arranged marriage traditions and a disapproval of divorce. (A->B not necessarily B->A.)
You're right, but at the same time you are not directly addressing the question: Societies where marriages are based of 'love' have a very high divorce rate. Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process. But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate. What the question really boils down to is this: Are people happier in general in societies with predominantly arranged marriages or in socie…
"Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process."
That depends strongly on jurisdiction and the particulars of the divorce. I had a mutually-agreed divorce last year, and it only took a coupla months, and was less than $1K. The legal and financial part of the divorce were by far the easiest parts of it.
Re: Ineligible Bachelors: Indian Men Living in U.S. Strike Out
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're joking, right? The logical flaw in that question isn't poking you in the eyeball as you type? Whenever a society is permissive of divorce, the divorce rate rises. When a society strongly disapproves of divorce (or makes it legally tough), well, that's another matter. There's a high correlation between societies with arranged marriage traditions and a disapproval of divorce. (A->B not necessarily B->A.)
You're right, but at the same time you are not directly addressing the question: Societies where marriages are based of 'love' have a very high divorce rate. Divorce in America or Europe is not easy, it's a long and expensive process. But there is still a 50% or so divorce rate. What the question really boils down to is this: Are people happier in general in societies with predominantly arranged marriages or in socie…
Nearly half of marriages fail, but not half of all first marriages. A simple example to illustrate: consider a sample of 4 happily married men and one guy with 4 ex wives. Half of the marriages failed, but 4/5 guys are happily married.
If you want to avoid divorce, don't marry a divorcee.
Incidentally, while divorce == FAIL, unhappy marriage == EPIC FAIL. But I guess the latter is hard to measure, so lets just focus on the former.