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We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

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Re: We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

#181

Post by lurker14 »

Retric wrote: post #169
Domenic_S wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So much wrong with this statement I almost threw my monitor out the window. Broke is temporary. Poor is a state of mind and often may be permanent. More importantly, the implication is that without money, your life is meaningless - which is a terrible lie to believe. There is no middle class anymore : a line created by average folks who earn an average wage and spend too much and make minimum monthly payments on ever…

Look, I save almost 1/4 of my income and I still feel poor in many ways. It's not about spending habits it's being able to survive bad shit financially. A friend of mine had a single seizure while looking for work and could not drive for 6 months plus significant medical bills. IMO, if you can't survive a minor medical issue financially then your not middle class and it's really hard to get there before 35 or if you…

No one is immune to everything forever -- not even billionaire Steve Jobs. your friend wasn't poor before his seizure, but the seizure knocked him down.

And of course several countries in the world do provide for the disabled. Even the US provides some support.

Re: We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

#182

Post by lurker14 »

jbooth wrote: post #48
mdpye wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Growth, and positive interaction with the rest of the world?

Balance that against the positive ego effects of thinking that you pulled yourself up by your bootstraps and built the log cabin you were born in. Parent post was right for a good number of people.

And the rest of us are well within our rights to not tolerate those people.

Re: We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

#183

Post by lurker14 »

orangethirty wrote: post #141
Domenic_S wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So much wrong with this statement I almost threw my monitor out the window. Broke is temporary. Poor is a state of mind and often may be permanent. More importantly, the implication is that without money, your life is meaningless - which is a terrible lie to believe. There is no middle class anymore : a line created by average folks who earn an average wage and spend too much and make minimum monthly payments on ever…

You do make valid points. Yet I reason you are reading two much between the lines. My point is that there are less opportunities for people to make a good standard living than there were before. That is simply from my POV, and I can definitely be wrong.

Before when? Maybe a few years ago was better. But 50 years? 100? No way.

Re: We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

#184

Post by lurker14 »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #83
cllns wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe. This is a tough point. The 'system' obviously sucks but I don't want to skirt personal responsibility. It's the upper-middle class straight white cisgendered male's fault if he doesn't take the time to learn about his privilege. He has the resources, but chooses to ignore it. (Note: I'm not saying the person from the article necessarily fits this description; I'm speaking more generally)

Interestingly people who are upper middle class and devote time and energy to the cause of the poor are often disparaged for that. Terms like "champagne socialist" or "bleeding heart liberal" are invoked. Perhaps it is seen as patronising to the poor because it makes the implication that the poor need the help of upper middle class white people to help them out of their problems?

People who use the terms "champagne socialist" or "bleeding heart liberal" as insults are fellow rich people who feel socially threatened by the people they insult.

Re: We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

#185

Post by lurker14 »

sarde wrote: post #164
BoredAstronaut wrote: post #148

I'm not sure how long the OP has been an arm-chair social scientist, but I've been one for twenty-five years, and I feel like I might be able to share some insights. Firstly, his thesis could be boiled down to a very simple question: "Why do people do what they do (instead of what I want them to do)?" You suggest that they are insufficiently self-reflective, not very world-wise, and perhaps just a bit self-centred. T…

As someone who seriously considered becoming an academic economist, I think you're spot on in your analysis about human motivation except for one thing: altruism. Altruism does exist, and not just because people want the "good feeling" of having done "good deeds." I've seen Levitt of the University of Chicago speak several times about an altruism experiment that economists conducted showing the lack of altruism in pe…

Simple experiment. Make a website with 3 buttons, and invite 10K people to visit. Make strong assurances of anonymity: and independent 3rd party will select the participants, logs will be destroyed, etc:

* Bill my credit card $20, donate to a pool to send to http://www.againstmalaria.com or somesuch. * Spend $20 of the researchers' money on fresh vegetables, and throw them in the trash. * Do nothing.

Re: We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

#187

Post by anoncow »

nooneelse wrote: post #110
anoncow wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO I want to make things, cool things, innovative things, things that add value to peoples lives, things that will save lives, things that others will appreciate, and things that will make me happy and content. If I could achieve this without having to think about getting rich or becoming broke, I would. I don't want personal fame or appreciation either. I just want to be. I just want to do.

Are you envisioning a monastic-like group dedicated to turning productive making toward eradicating human suffering and the like?

>Are you envisioning a monastic-like group

No, I did not think about it that way. I was thinking more on the lines of honest work and honest pay. Though if money was not a constraint many of us would be monks(as far as work is concerned).

Re: We call ourselves innovators, but most of us are really just iterators

#188

Post by eplanit »

shardling wrote: post #165
jasonlotito wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I disagree with "Because we want to get rich". And I definitely disagree with "of course". Real hackers do this because we just have to. Ignoring the awful "real hackers" commentary, one has nothing to do with what the article was referencing at the time: starting a company. At the core, if you start a company, you want to make money. Unless you are going the non-profit route, you are in it to make money, and that…

> Unless you are going the non-profit route, you are in it to make money, and that means getting rich. What a depressing outlook. Is there no room for people who want to make enough money to get by while doing what they love?

Yes, they are called "employees". People inclined to pursue work on what they enjoy are often very happy to achieve a comfortable salary with decent benefits. There is nothing wrong with that. The difference is in depth of passion, and in how much that is part of the individual's identity. I respect entrepreneurs, and I also respect the humble employee. For the entrepreneur, I think it is overly simplistic to say is it solely about greed and wealth. I know some very successful people, and most all tell me that the journey and experience is what drives them.
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