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How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

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Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#11
For me this is really simple, i usually goto sleep at 11pm-12pm and wake up at 7-8am without an alarm or anything and i feel great, so i figure that 7-8hours is optimal for me.

I try to keep that routine during the week, because if i stay up too long only 1 night, it makes it more difficult for the rest of the week. I am more of a morning person anyway, rarely been very productive late at night.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#12

> “Sleeping 8.5 hr. might really be a little worse than sleeping 5 hr.” How can people even take this kind of pseudo-science seriously? If I sleep for 5 hrs, I'm a complete zombie during the day, unproductive and depressed. If I sleep for 8.5 hrs (which is how long I sleep naturally), I feel great, productive, and happy. I get way more done. There are all sorts of studies showing all the negative effects of not getti…

Thanks for the anecdote, and for comparing a 5-hr night of sleep to a 24-hour work shift.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#13
The author states earlier in the article that we don't really understand sleep and that there is no one solution for everyone. He then proceeds to make a list of "top three" concrete and (IMO) questionable suggestions that he thinks we should follow. Not a great article.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#14
In general, most people (in the United States, the country I live in) need more sleep than they are getting. One way this is put to the test is by letting people relax in a comfortable reclining chair in a quiet, dark room during daylight working hours. Many people fall asleep in this condition, signaling that they are sleep-deprived, even if they have no regular habit of taking a nap in the daytime.

I have lived in a country (Taiwan) where a siesta, a mid-day nap, is quite a regular practice. The first time I lived there (1982-1985), I was only unlearning my American habit of sleeping only at night near the end of my stay. The second time I lived there (1998-2001), I was better able to adapt to napping in the middle of the day like my co-workers, perhaps because I had become a care-giving parent of young children in the meanwhile.

As the submitted blog post mentions, there is a research basis for thinking that symptoms of what is characterized as "lack of executive function" or "ADD" can be relieved just by getting sufficient sleep. It appears that one of the roles of sleep is letting the brain have opportunity to restructure based on new experiences while awake, so sleep seems to aid learning, planning, and attention control.

I had a friend back in my college days who was a very hard-working research scientist trying to find a cure for diabetes. Her claim, which she read somewhere back in the 1970s, was that an hour of sleep before midnight is just about as beneficial as two hours of sleep after midnight. It does seem to me that I wake up especially rested on the rare occasions when I am fully asleep for the night before 11:00pm. As my own lifestyle changes over the next decade (= as my children grow up and live on their own), I will be eager to try the experiment of better matching my hours of sleep with the actual hours of darkness in my time zone.

AFTER EDIT: The top level comment by rayiner mentions allergies and writes

I jack up a humidifier

and I agree with his statement that it is worthwhile to figure out what helps sleep be deeper and less disturbed, including breathing without obstruction during sleep. Depending on what a person is allergic to, DE-humidifying may be the way to go. Dust mite allergies, for example, will be worse for a person who lives in a humid room. Good luck to all in your experiments.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#15
There was an article in NYTimes a little while ago that suggested that getting six hours of sleep a night for two weeks was equivalent to being awake for 24 hours:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/17/magazine/mag-17Sleep-t.htm...

All told, by the end of two weeks, the six-hour sleepers were as impaired as those who, in another Dinges study, had been sleep-deprived for 24 hours straight — the cognitive equivalent of being legally drunk.

My personal experience certainly tells me that a solid eight hours a night makes me far more productive than consistently getting six.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#16
There are plenty of observational anecdotes of what works and what does not work.

In order to make the best of your sleep cycle, it requires excellent sleep hygiene.

1. regularity is important. Going to bed and waking up at the same times weekday and weekend is very helpful.

2. sleep environment is important. simulating night time including shades, turning off message beeps, comfort, slightly cool temperatures make a big difference

3. eating - avoiding eating at least 3-4 hours prior to bedtime. Your blood sugar levels are easily disturbed and play a large part in your sleep cycle as glucocorticoids are active in sleep cycle.

The amount you sleep has a lot to do with your daily stress level, physical activity and damage your body takes.

hydrate like crazy, let your body perform its reparative miracles at night including memory consolidation.

I have noticed that people who have constant low-level death-by-a-thousand-cuts stress have many problems sleeping and getting quality sleep than those who have short bursts of high level stress. We are victims of our always-on world.

As another poster pointed out - Sleep is worth experimenting. Physical activity/exercise during the day helps.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#17
post #7

It's common sense that 8 straight hours per day is not ideal in general, nevermind for everyone. If you check out your sleep rhythms (and with exercise and without stimulants like alcohol, coffee, nicotine, etc.) the ideal is usually something like: 1) sleep 5.5ish hours. 2) wake up at like 3am, work for an hour or two 3) sleep for another 1.5ish hours 4) wake up at dawn and somewhere in the early afternoon take a br…

The ideal is waking up at 3am to do work? I can't think of many things that seem less like common sense than that. In the absence of an alarm or anything to wake me up sooner, I sleep straight through to the morning. I much prefer it that way, to be honest.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#18

You know how there's people that can get by on 4-5 hours of sleep each night? I think I'm the opposite. Left to my own devices, I will sleep 10-10.5 hours a day. If I wake up with anything less than 9, I feel pretty horrible. Not sure why, but I sure wish I could get by on less.

Very similar here, although it's decreasing as I age. In my twenties I needed 9.5-10 hours per night to feel optimally sharp and focused; 10 years later my requirement seems to be down around 9 hours.

Although, like most hot-air-pushers in these sleep threads, I never tried objective measurements of performance under different circumstances. Maybe I just _feel_ like shit, but actually perform well, with less than 9 hours of sleep.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#19
I don't think humans evolved with alarm clocks. In an ideal world, would you not let yourself sleep as long as your brain deems appropriate? I think sunset and sunrise times would end up meaning a lot more.

The post also doesn't seem to account for sleep debt. If you undersleep one night, you may have to sleep longer than normal the next night to make up for it.

Re: How much sleep do we really need to work productively?

#20
The bit about the 3PM dip is not just about meridian cycles.

Since I gave up carbohydrates, I haven't had that hypoglycaemic productivity dip at a predictable time after lunch. As a contractor, I've sat in different offices and witnessed those around me experience 'the dip', whereas I can now soldier on through the day from morning to evening with consistent alertness and focus levels. Oh, and creatine supplementation helped a lot, too.

Another useful trick is to buy a blackout blind or window cover. I've managed to make my bedroom pitch black from the beginning to the end of my sleep cycle, and I know that my sleep is much better for it. It goes without saying that if the sun rises early where you live, and you happen to go to sleep late one night, it can be impossible to get the full 8 hours you want if the light starts streaming in before you've finished.

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