Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC • Hacker News Board

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#31

Post by nawitus » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:45 PM UTC

knowaveragejoe wrote: post #24

nawitus wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it's apparently possible to short bitcoins. If the recent rise in price is a bubble, and it crashes back to about $30, it will still come back to about $100 in a year, if bitcoin adoption continues.

Has there been adoption for essential goods & services? All I've seen so far are Internet services.

Smaller shops and corporations will naturally adopt first. There's many cafeterias and restaurants that accept bitcoins these days, but adoption will naturally start from internet-related services.

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#32

Post by kiba » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:45 PM UTC

nawitus wrote: post #26

Atropos wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole "Cyprus people are getting into Bitcoin" narrative is a total lie as well. But I guess Bitcoin is a great learning opportunity for spotting Scams etc., as long as people don't lose too much money, it might even be beneficial.

So you can objectively tell that "bitcoin is a scam"? Sure, there might be bubbles, but that doesn't mean bitcoin is a scam.

I think he meant getting scammed in bitcoinland, rather than thinking bitcoin itself is a scam.

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#33

Post by dragontamer » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:46 PM UTC

Atropos wrote: post #18

faet wrote: post #7

This feels kinda like a pump and dump to me. I don't mind articles/projects/sites that make use of bitcoins. But the frequency of posts on how much each bitcoin is worth feels like pennystocks/etc on an investing forum. People trying to get more people to buy in. To drive it up. So they can get out while it's high.

The whole "Cyprus people are getting into Bitcoin" narrative is a total lie as well. But I guess Bitcoin is a great learning opportunity for spotting Scams etc., as long as people don't lose too much money, it might even be beneficial.

While I'd like to believe you, a link to the "Cyprus lie" would be nice. :-)

I don't think "core bitcoin" users are scamming anyone. But at this point, the speed at which BTC has grown has triggered my "manipulation trigger". A decentralized currency is prone to manipulation... its not like there is an FCC out there to stop people from manipulating BTC.

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#34

Post by bonzoesc » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:47 PM UTC

oleganza wrote: post #6

niggler wrote: post #3

I hope that people who got in last year or earlier this year are starting to sell some of their bitcoins, at least enough to cover the cost basis. I wouldn't be surprised to see a very sharp fall soon.

Unless these people have invested extra money they can afford to lose for the reasons to save them from inflation and confiscation. Then they still have enough cash to pay the bills, so why should they get back to fiat? E.g. I myself and many of people I know are not going to sell a single Bitcoin unless any sort of personal or global disaster. And many of them are going to spend their BTC over time to avoid interact…

Fiat you can spend is more useful than fiat you can't.

> I myself and many of people I know are not going to sell a single Bitcoin unless any sort of personal or global disaster.

In the case of global disaster, who's going to be buying a fringe currency?

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#35

Post by oleganza » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:49 PM UTC

spartango wrote: post #28

I worry that as Bitcoin's value rises, people are buying in not to use it as payment for services or goods, but simply as an investment vehicle. In principle, there's nothing wrong with this; currency trading is common and well-explored. The problem is that the value of a currency is supposed to also be somehow related to its utility in acquiring goods and services. When it is rarely used to that effect, people may r…

"The problem is that the value of a currency is supposed to also be somehow related to its utility in acquiring goods and services."

Well, it is. As more people hold some BTC "for the future", they are more than willing to accept them as payment for their services. Imagine you are surrounded by people who have "hoarded" some BTC. Suddenly they can just trade in BTC without going to a bank (unless they have some spare cash which they haven't allocated to other purchases yet).

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#36

Post by PassTheAmmo » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:49 PM UTC

Atropos wrote: post #18

faet wrote: post #7

This feels kinda like a pump and dump to me. I don't mind articles/projects/sites that make use of bitcoins. But the frequency of posts on how much each bitcoin is worth feels like pennystocks/etc on an investing forum. People trying to get more people to buy in. To drive it up. So they can get out while it's high.

The whole "Cyprus people are getting into Bitcoin" narrative is a total lie as well. But I guess Bitcoin is a great learning opportunity for spotting Scams etc., as long as people don't lose too much money, it might even be beneficial.

Actually for me bitcoin proves just how few people can ACTUALLY spot a pyramid scheme or a pump and dump - instead resorting to calling everything that seems too good to be true a scam. It may work 99.9% of the time, but BTC is the false positive IMO. I totally agree that the Cyprus thing is totally bogus though, journalists are uninformed and lazy as usual. The real reason is that it seems more and more likely that bitcoin will be the currency of the Internet in the future. And nothing else.

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#37

Post by mef » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:49 PM UTC

spartango wrote: post #28

I worry that as Bitcoin's value rises, people are buying in not to use it as payment for services or goods, but simply as an investment vehicle. In principle, there's nothing wrong with this; currency trading is common and well-explored. The problem is that the value of a currency is supposed to also be somehow related to its utility in acquiring goods and services. When it is rarely used to that effect, people may r…

I think part of the reason for the optimism of those speculating bullishly on BTC is that the inherent properties of a decentralized finite online currency will result in their utility will only increase with time.

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#38

Post by knowaveragejoe » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:50 PM UTC

spartango wrote: post #28

I worry that as Bitcoin's value rises, people are buying in not to use it as payment for services or goods, but simply as an investment vehicle. In principle, there's nothing wrong with this; currency trading is common and well-explored. The problem is that the value of a currency is supposed to also be somehow related to its utility in acquiring goods and services. When it is rarely used to that effect, people may r…

That is my sentiment exactly. There is much talk of growing bitcoin adoption, but I've yet to see anything beyond a few web-based services(which, beyond their time, are almost free for the operators to begin with).

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#39

Post by kiba » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:51 PM UTC

spartango wrote: post #28

I worry that as Bitcoin's value rises, people are buying in not to use it as payment for services or goods, but simply as an investment vehicle. In principle, there's nothing wrong with this; currency trading is common and well-explored. The problem is that the value of a currency is supposed to also be somehow related to its utility in acquiring goods and services. When it is rarely used to that effect, people may r…

It'd also be interesting to look at the effects of deflation in the fledgling bitcoin economy, although the actual exchange of currency for goods and services is a bit small to judge this effectively.

The GDP stats for bitcoin is not systematically collected. The blockchain data only gives us a approximate picture.

So most people just rely on their guts and vague feeling about the size of the bitcoin economy. Bitcoin detractors tend to underestimate the size of bitcoin economy because they can't recall selling or buying goods or services. Bitcoin users tend to be more optimistic because they keep up with news of merchants opening up.

I think it would be very useful if somebody built a stats site dedicated to systematically report on economic activities occuring in bitcoinland.

Re: Bitcoin exchange rate reached $100 USD per BTC

#40

Post by quasque » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 2:52 PM UTC

oleganza wrote: post #6

niggler wrote: post #3

I hope that people who got in last year or earlier this year are starting to sell some of their bitcoins, at least enough to cover the cost basis. I wouldn't be surprised to see a very sharp fall soon.

Unless these people have invested extra money they can afford to lose for the reasons to save them from inflation and confiscation. Then they still have enough cash to pay the bills, so why should they get back to fiat? E.g. I myself and many of people I know are not going to sell a single Bitcoin unless any sort of personal or global disaster. And many of them are going to spend their BTC over time to avoid interact…

"And many of them are going to spend their BTC over time to avoid interaction with banking system as much as possible."

What is the purpose of avoiding the banking system?