Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#41

Post by lanstein » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:19 AM UTC

hkmurakami wrote: post #32

jhenkens wrote: post #9

I would love to know how many Model S have been sold within 25 miles of Palo Alto, CA. Driving around Menlo Park/Palo Alto/Atherton/Woodside, one can easily see 10 Model S within an hour - it is truly unreal. It's almost at the point where buying a Model S is no longer trend setting, but instead following a trend.

The thing is, my friend in SF says he rarely ever sees a model S. Granted SF isn't the most car-friendly city and the mental hurdle of driving from SV to SF prevents many people from driving into the city (I for one always take the bart from Daly City rather than drive in). SF is the most geographically close, high income center near SV, and yet it doesn't have many Model S's, despite the strong coolness factor that…

That is totally false. I see at least three/day in SoMa.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#42

Post by scottru » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:21 AM UTC

rurounijones wrote: post #5

kristofferR wrote: post #3

"Also being announced today is that the small battery option for the Model S will not enter production, due to lack of demand. Only four percent of customers chose the 40 kWh battery pack, which is not enough to justify production of that version. ... The customers who ordered this option will instead receive the 60 kWh pack, but range will be software limited to 40 kWh" Enter the range extending hacks!

Why not just stop sales of the 40kWh model, say "We are going to be nice and just upgrade them to 60kWh free of charge" and be done with it. Sure, some people who paid for the 60kWh packs will be annoyed paying "extra" for it but is that really such a concern that you have to start dicking about with what amounts to basically battery DRM? [EDIT] As someone mentioned below, if 40kWh models have already shipped then re…

No 40Kwh models have shipped.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#43

Post by spullara » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:21 AM UTC

hkmurakami wrote: post #32

jhenkens wrote: post #9

I would love to know how many Model S have been sold within 25 miles of Palo Alto, CA. Driving around Menlo Park/Palo Alto/Atherton/Woodside, one can easily see 10 Model S within an hour - it is truly unreal. It's almost at the point where buying a Model S is no longer trend setting, but instead following a trend.

The thing is, my friend in SF says he rarely ever sees a model S. Granted SF isn't the most car-friendly city and the mental hurdle of driving from SV to SF prevents many people from driving into the city (I for one always take the bart from Daly City rather than drive in). SF is the most geographically close, high income center near SV, and yet it doesn't have many Model S's, despite the strong coolness factor that…

You basically have to have a garage with power to buy one. There is a good reason they aren't as prevalent in the city as they are in the valley.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#44

Post by revelation » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:22 AM UTC

marshray wrote: post #36

"but range will be software limited to 40 kWh" DRM in my car that will leave me stranded by the side of the road. Wow, this is a new low even for DRM. No thank you. Tesla, you were kinda cool.

If you are stranded, then because the battery ran out of juice, DRM or not, since obviously how they are going to implement this is by limiting the maximum charge percentage [1].

Even an on the spot upgrade can't put more juice into the pack.

[1]: very easy to do in software and batteries last longer when they are not charged to full capacity. If they would charge over 40kWh, people would pay for electricity that they then couldn't use; that seems very unlikely.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#45

Post by kristofferR » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:22 AM UTC

jhenkens wrote: post #9

I would love to know how many Model S have been sold within 25 miles of Palo Alto, CA. Driving around Menlo Park/Palo Alto/Atherton/Woodside, one can easily see 10 Model S within an hour - it is truly unreal. It's almost at the point where buying a Model S is no longer trend setting, but instead following a trend.

They're becoming really popular in Norway too, in large part because of how incredibly cheap it is compared to the equivalent gasoline/diesel cars.

In the US the Model S is a quite expensive car, but here in Norway the taxes on gasoline/diesel cars are so high that the Model S actually is really cheap for its class. In the US the Model S have often been compared to the BMW M5, but in Norway the BMW costs 3x what the Model S does.

  595.000 NOK ($101.495 USD) for the Tesla Model S Performance
  884.600 NOK ($150.915 USD) the BMW ActiveHybrid 5
  1 766.500 NOK ($301.370 USD) for BMW M5

In addition to how cheap the car is to buy in itself, it's also much cheaper to own. It's allowed free toll road passage (which can save you a lot of money if you are paying $8 a day for your commute), free "fuel" through both free government and Tesla charging stations (gasoline/diesel is expensive here in Norway), free communal parking, free ferries and it is allowed to drive in taxi/bus lanes (for now at least ;) ).

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#46

Post by dangrossman » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:23 AM UTC

glenra wrote: post #35

dangrossman wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That article is neither "comprehensive" nor convincing. It's an overtly-biased opinion piece by a global climate change denier.

>It's an...opinion piece by a global climate change denier. Where by "denier" you presumably mean "person who thinks there might exist other important issues of concern in the world besides CO2 levels". Or perhaps you mean "person who believes public policy proposals ought to be able to pass a cost-benefit analysis "? Or do you mean, the sort of person who says stuff like: "Global warming is real and man-made, and it…

No, I mean the dictionary definition of the word. He called the greenhouse effect a "myth", and has been thoroughly discredited by the scientific community and respectable publications.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#47

Post by taligent » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:24 AM UTC

rurounijones wrote: post #6

Accidentally found myself in a Tesla showroom in Tokyo (Didn't even know they had one here) and the sales person was talking about how they had "sold out" in Japan which is promising. Also seeing the model S in person was rather cool.

You know what else "sold out". Palm Pre. Microsoft Surface. Nexus Q. Blackberry Playbook.

How are those doing ?

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#48

Post by taligent » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:28 AM UTC

teawithcarl wrote: post #4

Tesla is now running at $1.5 billion+ annually, and growing.

It is ?

For 2012 they had revenue of $413 million at a loss of $396 million.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#49

Post by rdl » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:28 AM UTC

spullara wrote: post #43

hkmurakami wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is, my friend in SF says he rarely ever sees a model S. Granted SF isn't the most car-friendly city and the mental hurdle of driving from SV to SF prevents many people from driving into the city (I for one always take the bart from Daly City rather than drive in). SF is the most geographically close, high income center near SV, and yet it doesn't have many Model S's, despite the strong coolness factor that…

You basically have to have a garage with power to buy one. There is a good reason they aren't as prevalent in the city as they are in the valley.

You can sometimes get it installed in a condo with underground parking, but even that is hard, and if you're just renting, it's a lot of hassle to go through. I've seen stories about people being charged >$500/mo for the hookup (with unlimited electricity, true) and absurd buildout costs.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#50

Post by marshray » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 6:32 AM UTC

revelation wrote: post #44

marshray wrote: post #36

"but range will be software limited to 40 kWh" DRM in my car that will leave me stranded by the side of the road. Wow, this is a new low even for DRM. No thank you. Tesla, you were kinda cool.

If you are stranded, then because the battery ran out of juice, DRM or not, since obviously how they are going to implement this is by limiting the maximum charge percentage [1]. Even an on the spot upgrade can't put more juice into the pack. [1]: very easy to do in software and batteries last longer when they are not charged to full capacity. If they would charge over 40kWh, people would pay for electricity that the…

I don't think that's an obvious conclusion at all. Many rechargeable battery chemistries experience terrible failures if they are not fully charged or fully discharged on a regular basis.

Even still, as a consumer I find it offensive when the same resources are consumed to produce something and then crippled just to sell at a lower price. It's a sign of market inefficiency.

For pure software, it's different because the per-unit cost of production approaches zero.

But batteries are literally massive objects, and their capacity-per-mass is the major factor of their value. So if your car still has to accelerate and decelerate all the mass of a 60KWh battery yet its capacity is artificially limited to 40KWh, your vehicle is not only range-limited, it's heavier and less efficient.