How To Hire Me (or any other programmer) • Hacker News Board

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#91

Post by nollidge » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:15 PM UTC

niggler wrote: post #82

nollidge wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I'm vaguely aware that JS does ASI, but rather than waste brain space trying to understand it, I just use semicolons with everything. And anyway, what better test of language facility is there than having the person code something? Or looking at code they've written? Whiteboarding is a weird, artificial environment that's not going to represent the coder's natural behavior in the wild.

Putting someone in front of a computer gives them the freedom to google (true story: I used to do a paper exam, and then I found one person was googling when I was in the bathroom and left the guy unattended for a few minutes). "Whiteboarding is a weird, artificial environment that's not going to represent the coder's natural behavior in the wild." You don't use a whiteboard when you code? I love them. The whiteboard…

> Putting someone in front of a computer gives them the freedom to google

So? I use google all the time while coding.

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#92

Post by ibudiallo » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:16 PM UTC

CurtMonash wrote: post #18

I love that he just assumes people know the Heinlein quote. ("Specialization is for insects.")

I did not know what it was, and i am glad you brought it up :)

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#93

Post by logn » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:19 PM UTC

bcoates wrote: post #29

What am I supposed to do instead of the cookie-cutter technical interview? Right now I do "Ask any question that starts with the phrase “tell me about a time when”." for most of the interview. I'm trying to give them an opportunity to describe technical things they've done so I can drill into details and suss out if they're exaggerating their skill-set and/or incapable of communication. For perspective, I'm a schlub…

How about: hi, candidate, here's my laptop. I've created a guest account for you and installed an IDE with X programming language. Take some time to implement this original program I want done that can't be copied from google. I'll be back in 45 minutes and we can discuss your solution until our hour is up. Nice to meet you.

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#94

Post by mooreds » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:22 PM UTC

illektr1k wrote: post #35

mooreds wrote: post #3

Wow, full of great advice. The biggest one for me is: acknowledge applicants. I've hired and know what a hassle it can be, but use a system, and respond to everyone. Set deadlines, and if you miss them, acknowledge that. Look, this is a possible team member--why would they believe you'll treat them with respect when they are employees if you don't treat them with respect when they aren't? Basically, it's the golden r…

If you give me a few seconds of your time to say thanks, I probably won't mind spending a few minutes staying late to get a task completed.

Or thinking of a friend who might be a better fit for a position, or trying your product/service, or recommending your product/service, etc. The dividends of being kind and humane are pretty amazing.

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#95

Post by onemorepassword » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:23 PM UTC

VikingCoder wrote: post #75

onemorepassword wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but it's a Buyer's Market On what planet?

You think it's hard to find programmers, at any given level of skill? Maybe I've been fortunate enough to work for companies that had enough gravitational pull that we attract good candidates without trying very hard.

I was in that fortunate situation until last year. Now even that well has virtually dried up.

Some of the programmers in my team are fairly high profile within the community, but what they've been reporting back from conferences and meetups is "dude, half the people are trying to hire the other half..."

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#96

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:23 PM UTC

VikingCoder wrote: post #75

onemorepassword wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but it's a Buyer's Market On what planet?

You think it's hard to find programmers, at any given level of skill? Maybe I've been fortunate enough to work for companies that had enough gravitational pull that we attract good candidates without trying very hard.

[deleted]

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#97

Post by electrotype » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:23 PM UTC

There is one main point that will help me want to work for you :

- Show me your business doesn't considere developers as resources that are easy to replace. Because this is not true. I've never seen a successful project built by thousands and thousands of inexperimented or bad developers.

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#98

Post by VikingCoder » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:30 PM UTC

vinceguidry wrote: post #89

onemorepassword wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but it's a Buyer's Market On what planet?

> You think it's hard to find programmers, at any given level of skill? If it were easy to find programmers, you wouldn't have all these shops using spam-tactic recruiters to drive volume. They wouldn't need to. It's most definitely a seller's market, if programmers can take their pick of corporate gig | freelancing | startup. My last job hunt took one hour. Their search went on for two months. If they fired me I cou…

> you wouldn't have all these shops using spam-tactic recruiters to drive volume.

I think those are unrelated concepts. I think connecting with the right pool of talent is an art, and a lot of shops are completely artless.

> It's most definitely a seller's market, if programmers can take their pick

Maybe I've been lucky, but I've never worked at a company that felt like we couldn't take our pick of applicants. Especially the lower down the scale we went.

> My last job hunt took one hour.

I have applicants for positions that don't exist. My applicant search takes negative time.

> If they fired me I could line up a dozen interviews next week

If someone quits, I can line up a dozen candidates next week.

> they'd still have to wade through a sea of unqualified/foreign/unmotivated alternatives.

Every day, you make judgements about which companies would be fun to work through - you're always doing that background processing.

> they interviewed a dozen guys before me.

So, as a Buyer, they had a line of candidates applying. Most of their problem was probably announcing to the world that they had an open position that people should know to apply to. That sounds like a Buyer's Market to me.

> I don't know where you're getting the idea that it's a buyer's market for programming talent.

The length of time I've seen open positions sit unfilled, and the number of applicants who'd be qualified to fill it.

In any market, a good that's sufficiently - well - "valuable" - will be picked up in no time. Congrats on crossing that threshold, I guess.

But yes, I consider it a Buyer's Market.

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#99

Post by edw519 » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:32 PM UTC

mindcrime wrote: post #80

edw519 wrote: post #23

How to hire me: 1. Tell me about the 3 biggest things you must accomplish. 2. Tell me why you must accomplish them. 3. Tell me when you must accomplish them by. 4. Tell me how you intend to accomplish them. 5. Tell me what you're already doing to accomplish them. 6. Tell me the role you envision me playing in accomplishing them. 7. Tell me what you expect from me. 8. Put me with some of the key people already working…

That's some good stuff, but I'd add a couple: 1a. Show me the office I'll be working in. Any "open plan" or "2+ people per office" setup decreases your odds of hiring me by about 93%. Not to say I'll never take a job like that, but it really, really hurts your odds. 1b. Show me the rest of the building... are there common areas where people can hang out and collaborate away from their offices, preferably with natural…

I purposely didn't include any of yours. Why?

1. Mine are issues and yours are details. If my 10 are satisfactory, I can live with your 9, even though some may not be satisfactory. But if you 9 are good and my 10 aren't, I'd last about a year before moving on because of lack of meaning.

2. Mine are about them, yours are about you.

3. Mine show interest in the big picture; yours could easily paint you as a demanding nit-picker (whether you are or not).

Yours are important and a good list. I just don't think I ever would (or ever have) discussed them with a prospective employer.

And thanks for the tip on the Thai. I'm googling "Midtown Miami" and "Mussuman Curry" as soon as I finish typing this.

Re: How To Hire Me (or any other programmer)

#100

Post by blackdogie » Fri, Mar 22, 2013, 9:32 PM UTC

renegadedev wrote: post #87

I just got an email from a recruiter who's looking for a SQL DBA. The applicant must know (note the lack of mention of DBA skills): Java Script, jQuery, CHTML, CSS I also frequently get asked by recruiters "how much do you make?". How is my current salary any of their business?

Personally I don't think that recruiters are worth paying any attention to. At least not in the cookie cutter version. If they want to get in touch then that's cool, but if it's a generic email it will get labelled as SPAM.