Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Just Use Sublime Text

delvarworld.github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 296 posts

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#41

Post by ozataman »

1. I like learning new tools and I got pretty good at vim's 10-15 fundamental commands in probably a couple of weeks. I was certainly OK, albeit a bit slow, by day 2 or so.

2. By the end of month 1-2, vim had become completely second nature. I did stuff without thinking. Actually, thinking about what I was doing started to confuse me.

3. Sure we all spend lots of time thinking, but I also often find myself cranking out code and vim is quite amazing for that.

4. I ended up switching to emacs because a) I like learning about tools (see #1) b) emacs gives you a more IDE-like experience c) while retaining 90% of vim's editing power d) and in general has the similar "become an editor expert" philosophy to optimizing editing workflow

I haven't used sublime, but I'm quite fond of editors that are keyboard-only (especially for jumping around, etc.), cross-platform, have stood the test of time and have endless extensibility.

edit: I have customized both vim and emacs to crazy depths. There was a time when just as I started to code, I'd say "why can't I do this [blah] drudgery automatically?" and end up writing an emacs function to do it :-)

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#42

Post by Puer »

ebbv wrote: post #25

Am I the only person in the world who: a) Never thought vim was that hard to learn (and I first learned it when I was a teenager and nobody helped me. I switched when someone on a MUD made fun of me for using pico.) and b) Thinks vanilla vim works just fine. Seriously my vimrc is like 10 lines long and I don't even have it on every server I work on. I don't bother with any plugins. I don't need vim integrated with gi…

I switched from nano to vim a few hours ago. When I first installed Arch Linux all those months ago I was intimidated when I was presented with the choice between nano, the default, and vim, "for experts only." When I used vim for the first time today I expected it to be a lot more "difficult" based on everything I had read/heard prior, but after reaching the Arch Wiki entry I was able to hop right in with no difficulties at all. Honestly, the biggest "challenge" I'm facing so far is just getting used to typing "vim" when my brain is used to typing "nano." I'm not denying that vim is complex, and it will probably take me months to "master" it and use it to its full potential, but it isn't hard to just jump into and use, and like you mentioned vanilla vim works perfectly fine.

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#43

Post by ktsmith »

nthitz wrote: post #28

Can anyone explain that one liner at the end? :set tw=10000 | norm gggQG

I'm probably forgetting something but it should just be setting the terminal window to 10000 characters. So basically for the entire document word wrap won't happen automatically until a line reaches 10000 characters long.

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#44

Post by elteto »

Every time I read these comparisons I can't help but picture two guys arguing about screwdrivers:

Guy 1: Hey, mine is a flat head, definitely better! Guy 2: Nah, mine is a Torx, shiny and fancy, definitely superior!!

And these two guys always seem to forget that one works as a carpenter and the other one services electronics. I can't see much rationality in the argument.

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#45

Post by jaequery »

ozataman wrote: post #41

1. I like learning new tools and I got pretty good at vim's 10-15 fundamental commands in probably a couple of weeks. I was certainly OK, albeit a bit slow, by day 2 or so. 2. By the end of month 1-2, vim had become completely second nature. I did stuff without thinking. Actually, thinking about what I was doing started to confuse me. 3. Sure we all spend lots of time thinking, but I also often find myself cranking o…

at the end, emacs always wins :)

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#46

Post by kstrauser »

jchiu1106 wrote: post #37
ob wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I learned emacs first and became reasonably proficient in it. Some years ago, I joined a company where most people used vi. I saw it as an opportunity to use vi (also vim) and I already knew a bit of vi from editing unix config files. I spent almost 3 years working exclusively in vi. I got used to it enough to handcraft my own .vimrc file, use multiple buffers, integrate with ctags, etc etc. I think I was reasonably…

I hear you. My point is either vim or emacs is a much better choice than those "beginner-friendly" editors that the op would recommend to new devs. Simple: no pain, no gain. Both vim and emacs are painful enough for most people to learn, but the reward is substantial and long-lasting. Side note: I think I'd love emacs if I hadn't learned vim first. Having a real programming language (elisp) for configuration and exte…

Sure, but for the record, Sublime isn't exactly a "beginner-friendly" editor in the "click and drool sense". It offers menus for common operations, but I think of it more as Emacs But With Python than something I'd hand to a new user.

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#47

Post by justinhj »

If you intend to be a professional programmer for 10 years, 20 years, maybe 40 years, why is it a big deal to spend 2 years becoming adept at an editor? Vim and Emacs are both likely to be lifelong tools that will easily repay the difficult early days.

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#48

Post by ozataman »

jaequery wrote: post #45
ozataman wrote: post #41

1. I like learning new tools and I got pretty good at vim's 10-15 fundamental commands in probably a couple of weeks. I was certainly OK, albeit a bit slow, by day 2 or so. 2. By the end of month 1-2, vim had become completely second nature. I did stuff without thinking. Actually, thinking about what I was doing started to confuse me. 3. Sure we all spend lots of time thinking, but I also often find myself cranking o…

at the end, emacs always wins :)

Sorry for the cliche, but the obligatory: http://xkcd.com/378/

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#49

Post by cjh_ »

msoad wrote: post #22
d0m wrote: post #21

I think the OP has never seen a very efficient VIM user crack some code. There are some valid points but they are surrounded by unnecessary ranting and lack of knowledge. >> Don’t you ever think you can beat a mouse. Only in very few edge cases will it even matter. Already saw someone clicking the "Search" button on a google page instead of pressing Enter? This is the same sensation I get when I see someone editing c…

I agree. I would say even if you are using Sublime Text don't touch the keyboard. You can do EVERYTHING without mouse in sublime text.

>Don't touch the keyboard

>You can do EVERYTHING without the mouse

What are you using to edit text with? The power of thought?

Re: Just Use Sublime Text

#50

Post by readme »

Arzh wrote: post #18
fumonko wrote: post #9

My friends, I had not intended to discuss this controversial subject at this particular time. However, I want you to know that I do not shun controversy. On the contrary, I will take a stand on any issue at any time, regardless of how fraught with controversy it might be. You have asked me how I feel about vim. All right, here is how I feel about vim: If when you say vim you mean the antiquated relic, the impossibly-…

I was thrown a bit when he say's "To code in Vim, you have to keep Vim in your head just as much as the code that you’re editing. You have to constantly think about what you’re doing." I have a few coworkers who work completely in vim while the rest of us use Visual Studio. I ask them questions about vim usage and usually they have to think a while about what they actually do because using vim is second nature to the…

Yeah.

I do not have to think about what I'm doing in vim, when it comes to normal text editing.

To be quite honest, getting up to normal-editor level with vim shouldn't take more than a month to become comfortable. Learning to move, yank, paste, and navigate windows is not hard and you really don't have to think about it.

More advanced usage I have to think about, but that's no different than if you had to think about what you were doing in sublime when you clicked search and replace and started typing in a regular expression.

Post reply on HN