While I basically agree with this article, it mainly added some stronger opinions to an Atlantic article from 1982. It didn't discuss synthetic/cultured diamonds, which recently became available at 'low' prices. DeBeers needs to convince people that a cheaper diamond is worse, even though they're really better quality! Also, how come the internet hasn't shaken up their hold on the re-selling market? If diamond sellers won't buy back diamonds from people, why can't people sell to each other online?
Diamonds Are Bullshit
411–420 of 774 posts
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#412Earlier quoted context omitted.
> so they just leave De Beers to run around gouging consumers That's kind of missing the point. If diamonds were 5 bucks a piece, women would no longer be interested in receiving rings bejeweled by them. A woman wants a man who is financially secure. If you can't afford a shiny rock, you can't afford what's coming after it either, so there's no point.
I doubt the point is to demonstrate financial security: Spending three months' salary on a single ring would seem to indicate financial irresponsibility more than financial security (unless it's like a rebate and you sell the ring once you're married? /s). I'm inclined to agree that you're right about the price being the point. I think it has more to do with "You're worth it to me". I still think it's utter bollocks.
Someone thinking it's utter bollocks but doing it anyway somewhat demonstrates that a partner is worth even more to them. ;)
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#413Earlier quoted context omitted.
Except it happens to be factually, empirically true. Read the behavioral & social psychology literature; double blind experiments.
So the world is filled with gold-diggers? No. Not true. You'll find it shocking that in some parts of the world people are happily married without any jewelry at all.
>So the world is filled with gold-diggers? No. Not true.
Wanting a mate who is financially secure doesn't make a woman a gold digger. It's no different than the vast majority of men who want a physically attractive mate.
>You'll find it shocking that in some parts of the world people are happily married without any jewelry at all.
Yes, different cultures have different standards (and there are outliers within cultures). In some places a herd of goats functions as a status symbol, in the US a diamond serves this function.
That doesn't mean that every woman here absolutely requires a man who can buy her a diamond, but the majority do.
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#414Earlier quoted context omitted.
A car has some level of re-sale value though. UNlike a Diamond or a Wedding.
Good diamonds depreciate less than say cars or stereo equipment or computers. A Tiffany's ring with GIA certs can resell for half its original purchase price. There is an active secondary market in diamonds, so if you buy a high-quality GIA certified stone used, you should be able to sell it for a similar price to what you bought it for. Most of the depreciation on a diamond happens the moment you "drive it off the l…
Where is this secondary market that you speak of?
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#415I see people talking about various things like the (1) (2) (3) arguments for a women to evaluate a man : (1) is the ability to provide; 2) is the willingness to forgo other things (opportunity costs to talk economics) (3) "is demonstrating to the woman's peers her husband's social standing." (signalling) Raynier posted this deep down in a reply which might be lost to you if you don't read all the comments. It would b…
Its' really hard to live life stepping on eggshells worrying about injustices to other people. At the end of the day, I bet most people on this thread drive, and there is very little else that humans do that does more violence to the environment and to other humans than the use of fossil fuels. It goes far beyond that. If you're an American, your comfortable life exists because of the American government's willingnes…
Its' really hard to live life stepping on eggshells worrying about injustices to other people.
It's also really fulfilling. Just don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#416Earlier quoted context omitted.
It doesn't have anything to do with financial security. Look, if your man is spending three months worth of salary on a piece of shiny rock, he is exercising poor financial judgment and that is a signal against future financial security. Women want diamonds not because of any symbolic reasons ("Diamonds are forever!") but because of reasons that are much more practical: they want to be able to show off the diamonds t…
You absolutely nailed it with this comment. Was reading pieces of the debate out loud to my girlfriend, who is rather rational and intelligent but for some reason still wants a diamond ring (and I couldn't really figure out why) - when I read this and looked over, I knew you got it 100% right. Well done.
Yeah, the things that women do in order to outdo their female friends are expensive and pointless--almost as much so as the things that men do to outdo their male friends!
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#417(person I know) worked for GE (General Electric) on their industrial diamond production process back in the 90's, and I got to hear lots of fun stories from this. Diamonds that are man-made[1] are stronger (fewer imperfections) than those that are mined from the earth. Because of this, industrial diamonds tend to be man-made. (for reference, industrial diamonds when cutting hard materials, such as metals). While work…
> so they just leave De Beers to run around gouging consumers That's kind of missing the point. If diamonds were 5 bucks a piece, women would no longer be interested in receiving rings bejeweled by them. A woman wants a man who is financially secure. If you can't afford a shiny rock, you can't afford what's coming after it either, so there's no point.
This depiction is camouflaging itself as if it is a brutally truthful account of the way things are, but I don't see how it even remotely stacks up to reality from any angle you look at it.
* A minority of men are truly financially secure, doesn't seem to stop couples from marrying
* Lots of people marry when young, a time when financial situations tend to be weak/modest.
* With this kind of reasoning you might as well extend the 'what's the point to marriage' to include those who are financially secure, it's ridiculous
* A woman, calculating enough to decide the decision on whether to marry on the current finances of a man, is just as likely to assess a broad range of factors, such as health and future earning potential.
If you're going to take a sober point of view, a more convincing case is this: The social norms are that diamond rings are part of the marrying process, people, on the whole, tend to stick to the social norms. It's what is expected, it's cultural and doing feels 'wrong' and maybe even shameful. There's potential pain involved in not following the expected course of action. This is why people who go into extra debt to purchase an expensive ring, it's what it means if you don't get it.
If you have a couple that clouds their better judgment to meet expectations set by culture and by conforming to norms like a sheep, what's the point.
In my experience women (and men) want to feel special. If you are able to make your partner feel special on an ongoing basis, you have pretty good odds to create a meaningful partnership. A diamond ring purchase is not a reliable indicator of said ability (it may be indicative of the opposite, but that's another matter).
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#418Earlier quoted context omitted.
Except it happens to be factually, empirically true. Read the behavioral & social psychology literature; double blind experiments.
So the world is filled with gold-diggers? No. Not true. You'll find it shocking that in some parts of the world people are happily married without any jewelry at all.
Seeking financial security != gold digging.
It's not sexist or derogatory. Financial security and status are evolutionary concepts that predate the diamond district. Diamonds are just one manifestation of a deeper, hardwired instinct to seek fit and capable mates.
This isn't a cynical concept, it's backed by studies of the entire animal kingdom, not just humans.
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#419Earlier quoted context omitted.
So the world is filled with gold-diggers? No. Not true. You'll find it shocking that in some parts of the world people are happily married without any jewelry at all.
I find it shocking that there are people that think that a woman wanting financial security makes that woman a 'gold-digger'.
There is an enormous difference between wanting financial security and wanting someone to buy them a giant diamond ring as a token of it.
Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit
#420Earlier quoted context omitted.
It doesn't have anything to do with financial security. Look, if your man is spending three months worth of salary on a piece of shiny rock, he is exercising poor financial judgment and that is a signal against future financial security. Women want diamonds not because of any symbolic reasons ("Diamonds are forever!") but because of reasons that are much more practical: they want to be able to show off the diamonds t…
You absolutely nailed it with this comment. Was reading pieces of the debate out loud to my girlfriend, who is rather rational and intelligent but for some reason still wants a diamond ring (and I couldn't really figure out why) - when I read this and looked over, I knew you got it 100% right. Well done.
Then buy used (the diamond) and pay for a nice ring design. But don't tell her.