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Diamonds Are Bullshit

blog.priceonomics.com

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Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#101

Post by qiqing »

clicks wrote: post #52
drivebyacct2 wrote: post #17

Maybe I'm spoiled as a nerdy (and interested in nerdy) gay guy, but I pity those in this thread saying that their fiancee wouldn't listen to reason about this. It slays me that "tradition" is so important to people that they will waste such vast amounts of money and prop up such a gross, violent industry in the face of reason.

My sister is still mad as hell at her husband for not having spent enough for their wedding (he spent about $25k), and I've heard her once or twice complain about the ring. I'll occasionally take shots at my sister for this (because, well, she's my sister and she loves taking shots at me too so it's fair). But my God I don't dare challenge the issue of spending extravagantly on rings/weddings with another woman (I on…

A friend-of-a-friend of mine synthesized a diamond in his lab for his wife, and etched diffraction gratings on some of the lower faces to customize the frequency of reflected light (he could do arbitrary colors this way).

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#102

Post by surfaceTensi0n »

Zimahl wrote: post #72
drivebyacct2 wrote: post #17

Maybe I'm spoiled as a nerdy (and interested in nerdy) gay guy, but I pity those in this thread saying that their fiancee wouldn't listen to reason about this. It slays me that "tradition" is so important to people that they will waste such vast amounts of money and prop up such a gross, violent industry in the face of reason.

I pity those in this thread saying that their fiancee wouldn't listen to reason about this. Karma be damned but women as a whole are swayed more by marketing then men are. They've been sold the princess wedding, the diamond ring, the brand-name clothing, etc. It's difficult to break them of this so sometimes the fight isn't worth it. I didn't pay for my wedding so that was my in-laws problem although it wasn't grandi…

> women as a whole are swayed more by marketing then men are

Citation needed. Plenty of men are swayed by marketing -- for instance, you'll note that the marketing ploy in TFA is directed at men.

It's also worth noting that the commentary here is lopsided. There are comments from men saying they don't care about diamonds but their fiancee did, but you don't see a whole lot of the inverse (women saying "I don't care about diamonds") . One could easily assume that's because "women...are swayed more by marketing then men are". In reality, it's more likely due to HN's readership being predominantly male.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#103

Post by kscaldef »

clicks wrote: post #52
drivebyacct2 wrote: post #17

Maybe I'm spoiled as a nerdy (and interested in nerdy) gay guy, but I pity those in this thread saying that their fiancee wouldn't listen to reason about this. It slays me that "tradition" is so important to people that they will waste such vast amounts of money and prop up such a gross, violent industry in the face of reason.

My sister is still mad as hell at her husband for not having spent enough for their wedding (he spent about $25k), and I've heard her once or twice complain about the ring. I'll occasionally take shots at my sister for this (because, well, she's my sister and she loves taking shots at me too so it's fair). But my God I don't dare challenge the issue of spending extravagantly on rings/weddings with another woman (I on…

Not to mention that $25k is considered a completely reasonable amount to spend on a car.

There's no doubt that the wedding industry is a racket (oh, did you want your dinner guests to have forks? That'll be $3 each. Water glasses too? ...) but also there's something to be said for not cheaping out on what's ostensibly one of the most important days of your life. FWIW, we managed to pay less than many people, while getting much better food and drinks than the average wedding and a more memorable, personalized experience by foregoing traditional wedding venues and caterers and instead simply buying out one of our favorite restaurants for the evening.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#104

Post by [deleted] »

drivebyacct2 wrote: post #66
sliverstorm wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody does it "for the sake of tradition". It is a web of expectations where the cost of bucking the expectations is great enough that buckling often is the more attractive option. It is also a well-entrenched example of costly signaling [1] in humans [2] (For the lazy, costly signaling basically says, a costly empty gesture is a strong indicator of mate quality, because only a high-quality mate can afford to waste…

Sorry, the link to honest signaling is a bit lost on me, can you elaborate? Are you saying that people buy diamond rings because it's expected? I would hope there would be a discussion about that before going out and buying a ring. (And if not, I would consider that part of the "tradition" of: the man must propose, the man must spend a fortune on the ring, the man must surprise the woman on one knee, etc). Anyway, so…

[deleted]

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#105

Post by ohsnapman »

jpdoctor wrote: post #26
arbuge wrote: post #13

"So here is a modest proposal: Let’s agree that diamonds are bullshit and reject their role in the marriage process. Let’s admit that as a society we got tricked for about century into coveting sparkling pieces of carbon, but it’s time to end the nonsense." Hear hear, but good luck convincing zillions of single women that they'll be the first generation in living memory to miss out on their carbon.

The carbon is a proxy (which is missed in the article, among other things.) It's social signaling. Or to put it another way: How many $$ can your man throw away without incurring pauperhood?

Here's a link for the equivalent evolutionary theory: http://octavia.zoology.washington.edu/handicap_old/handicap_...

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#106

Post by stephengillie »

cobrausn wrote: post #49

Sure, and we all know it. But from her perspective, you probably waste all kinds of time and money on other inane bullshit for yourself. So if you actually cared, you wouldn't mind spending a bit so she gets a shiny rock to wear around. Why shouldn't she get this one thing? Also, how is this any different from fashion? Both are nearly useless raw materials that have been transformed and shaped into something people w…

If she wants it so badly, why doesn't she buy herself one?

If she doesn't have enough money, then she should work until she does. Or she should provide something of equivalent value, at which point this becomes a business negotiation.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#107

Post by ohsnapman »

jamesaguilar wrote: post #91
Zimahl wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I pity those in this thread saying that their fiancee wouldn't listen to reason about this. Karma be damned but women as a whole are swayed more by marketing then men are. They've been sold the princess wedding, the diamond ring, the brand-name clothing, etc. It's difficult to break them of this so sometimes the fight isn't worth it. I didn't pay for my wedding so that was my in-laws problem although it wasn't grandi…

> Karma be damned but women as a whole are swayed more by marketing then men are To make a claim like this, I'd normally expect data, not a bunch of anecdotes. Men I know are highly swayed by marketing as well. They want expensive cars, tools, games, alcohol, and other toys. It is hard to reason about the degree to which each is influenced solely from the products that are marketed to them. It is quite a stretch for…

Totally agree. I see so many comments on HN along the lines of "ads don't work on me". Guess what? They do. You just don't know it. That's how good they've gotten.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#108

Post by jamesaguilar »

pbateman wrote: post #53
drivebyacct2 wrote: post #17

Maybe I'm spoiled as a nerdy (and interested in nerdy) gay guy, but I pity those in this thread saying that their fiancee wouldn't listen to reason about this. It slays me that "tradition" is so important to people that they will waste such vast amounts of money and prop up such a gross, violent industry in the face of reason.

Agreed. It's also a massive red flag for the future of the relationship if you can't negotiate over something like this.

Or a sad commentary on your negotiating skills.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#109

Post by [deleted] »

drivebyacct2 wrote: post #17

Maybe I'm spoiled as a nerdy (and interested in nerdy) gay guy, but I pity those in this thread saying that their fiancee wouldn't listen to reason about this. It slays me that "tradition" is so important to people that they will waste such vast amounts of money and prop up such a gross, violent industry in the face of reason.

[deleted]

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#110

Post by toast76 »

Trying to argue against engagement rings is like arguing against internet censorship. Your opinion is tainted before you open your mouth because the only people who could possibly oppose such things are cheap bastards or pedophiles, respectively.

If you refuse to buy a diamond, it's because you're cheap or don't love "her" enough. No amount of hand waving or sensible logic will make up for the fact that you'll just look like an asshole.

There's no logic in love, just shut up and buy her the damned ring.

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