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Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

arstechnica.com

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Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#31

Post by drucken »

Karunamon wrote: post #12

Reposting and responding to a dead comment by lexarchy: -- > This is a clever hack, but I question the motives of both the father and Ars Technica. Must we erase—or invert—all aspects of yin and yang, simply to appease the gods of equality? You may have heard the French phrase vive la différence, which translates as "long live the difference", but do you know what it refers to? It means "let's celebrate the differenc…

we're making a harmless part of videogame history a political and social justice issue

Who's "we"?

Also, I know how the three year old feels, i.e. how sad I am when I have to play role playing games or multiplayer games as male!

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#32

Post by arrrg »

Karunamon wrote: post #12

Reposting and responding to a dead comment by lexarchy: -- > This is a clever hack, but I question the motives of both the father and Ars Technica. Must we erase—or invert—all aspects of yin and yang, simply to appease the gods of equality? You may have heard the French phrase vive la différence, which translates as "long live the difference", but do you know what it refers to? It means "let's celebrate the differenc…

I think it’s pretty normal if you are tired of the constant portrayal of women as weak, helpless and passive in certain media.

What’s so wrong with calling out lazy storytelling based on dumb stereotypes? How can you even have a problem with that?

I also like how you just declare something harmless. Why, exactly? It’s a part of video game history that lives on and is anything but harmless.

Calling out crap is wrong – why exactly? Or is the portrayal of women as weak, helpless and passive – especially in a world where this is a popular stereotype – not crap?

Nobody wants to burn cartridges or rewrite history or ban old games. People (for the most part) don’t even demonize anyone for this or blame anyone for acting maliciously. Is pointing something out (or privately doing something about it) really such a big deal?

I really don’t get contrarians like you. Your arguments make no sense at all. (Except if you believe that women really are naturally weak, helpless and passive, i.e. hold sexist beliefs.)

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#33

Post by Karunamon »

arrrg wrote: post #32
Karunamon wrote: post #12

Reposting and responding to a dead comment by lexarchy: -- > This is a clever hack, but I question the motives of both the father and Ars Technica. Must we erase—or invert—all aspects of yin and yang, simply to appease the gods of equality? You may have heard the French phrase vive la différence, which translates as "long live the difference", but do you know what it refers to? It means "let's celebrate the differenc…

I think it’s pretty normal if you are tired of the constant portrayal of women as weak, helpless and passive in certain media. What’s so wrong with calling out lazy storytelling based on dumb stereotypes? How can you even have a problem with that? I also like how you just declare something harmless. Why, exactly? It’s a part of video game history that lives on and is anything but harmless. Calling out crap is wrong –…

>What’s so wrong with calling out lazy storytelling based on dumb stereotypes?

What exactly do you hope to accomplish by calling out arguably "lazy storytelling" (more like a homage to King Kong if some stories are to be believed) 32 years later?

It's like complaining about racism in the early Bugs Bunny cartoons. What exactly are you hoping to accomplish other than a gripe? Damn Nintendo for using a common story trope three decades ago!

What does this teach anyone? How horrible Nintendo is? What?

>I really don’t get contrarians like you. Your arguments make no sense at all. (Except if you believe that women really are naturally weak, helpless and passive, i.e. hold sexist beliefs.)

This was utterly unnecessary. If I'm a "contrarian", you are someone who searches for things to be offended by.

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#34

Post by arrrg »

Karunamon wrote: post #33
arrrg wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s pretty normal if you are tired of the constant portrayal of women as weak, helpless and passive in certain media. What’s so wrong with calling out lazy storytelling based on dumb stereotypes? How can you even have a problem with that? I also like how you just declare something harmless. Why, exactly? It’s a part of video game history that lives on and is anything but harmless. Calling out crap is wrong –…

>What’s so wrong with calling out lazy storytelling based on dumb stereotypes? What exactly do you hope to accomplish by calling out arguably "lazy storytelling" (more like a homage to King Kong if some stories are to be believed) 32 years later? It's like complaining about racism in the early Bugs Bunny cartoons. What exactly are you hoping to accomplish other than a gripe? Damn Nintendo for using a common story tro…

Uhm, you do know that the trope lives on in Mario games? You are aware of that?

Also, looking at history can be interesting and illustrative.

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#36

Post by Karunamon »

arrrg wrote: post #34
Karunamon wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What’s so wrong with calling out lazy storytelling based on dumb stereotypes? What exactly do you hope to accomplish by calling out arguably "lazy storytelling" (more like a homage to King Kong if some stories are to be believed) 32 years later? It's like complaining about racism in the early Bugs Bunny cartoons. What exactly are you hoping to accomplish other than a gripe? Damn Nintendo for using a common story tro…

Uhm, you do know that the trope lives on in Mario games? You are aware of that? Also, looking at history can be interesting and illustrative.

You are aware that the particular character hasn't appeared in a game since?

You are aware that the trope you're referring to has been subverted, inverted, and toyed with just about every way possible by the very same company?

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#37

Post by [deleted] »

Karunamon wrote: post #36
arrrg wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhm, you do know that the trope lives on in Mario games? You are aware of that? Also, looking at history can be interesting and illustrative.

You are aware that the particular character hasn't appeared in a game since? You are aware that the trope you're referring to has been subverted, inverted, and toyed with just about every way possible by the very same company?

[deleted]

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#38

Post by arrrg »

Karunamon wrote: post #36
arrrg wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhm, you do know that the trope lives on in Mario games? You are aware of that? Also, looking at history can be interesting and illustrative.

You are aware that the particular character hasn't appeared in a game since? You are aware that the trope you're referring to has been subverted, inverted, and toyed with just about every way possible by the very same company?

I certainly am. What has that to do with the comment I made?!

Also, I am not aware of any serious attempts inside the Mario franchise to seriously subvert or invert the trope.

I see an endless history of portraying women as weak, helpless and passive. Sad, really.

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#39

Post by chaz »

alanctgardner2 wrote: post #24
lifeisstillgood wrote: post #5

I will harp on about the importance of code literacy and open source / free software till the cows come home but this is the best example I know: We would never vote up a article where "father writes bedtime story for daughter, Sleeping Prince rescued by Princess". Because it is commonplace because literacy is commonplace, as are pens and paper commonplace and as are the legal frameworks to be allowed to alter the pu…

Why do people insist on foisting "software literacy" on the general populace? In terms of skills, financial planning, cooking, interpersonal skills are all more essential than reading and writing code. The writing analogy is off anyways: not everyone can write very well. People would upvote -and buy- a children's story by, say, neil gaiman. This is not the equivalent of a throwaway story made up on the spot.

Everyone should learn to write. This should not be taken as "learn to write a novel." The practice of writing develops skills in articulating opinions, clarifying purpose, supporting with facts, and raising clear questions -- skills useful even if pen is never put to paper.

Similarly, "learning to code" is not to be taken as "be a programmer." Rather, learning to code is a means to developing skills in analyzing problems, establishing goals, breaking down big tasks into small tasks, understanding cause and effect, etc -- skills that are useful far beyond software. Learning to code isn't the only way to learn these skills, but it's a fun, easy, and accessible way to do all of them at the same time.

Re: Dad hacks Donkey Kong for his daughter; Pauline now saves Mario

#40

Post by columbo »

Karunamon wrote: post #12

Reposting and responding to a dead comment by lexarchy: -- > This is a clever hack, but I question the motives of both the father and Ars Technica. Must we erase—or invert—all aspects of yin and yang, simply to appease the gods of equality? You may have heard the French phrase vive la différence, which translates as "long live the difference", but do you know what it refers to? It means "let's celebrate the differenc…

> This kind of put into words an odd feeling I was having about the whole "war of the sexes" vibe

What vibe?

> we're making a harmless part of videogame history a political and social justice issue

Who is doing that?

> What I don't understand is how one of the most common storytelling tropes in history (we're talking Shakespeare and then some) has suddenly become uncool to use

What are you trying to say?

I thought I read a story about a dad who wanted to make a game fun for his daughter. I read the article, I read it again, yep, it's a story about a dad making changes to a game for his daughter. What story did you read?

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