EmberJS Confuses Me

Very funny, LOL :). Answer these simple questions with out googling (Be honest :)) and score 80% to get a reply from me.

1) Is MVC an OOP concept ?

2) Is JS an Classical or Functional language ?

3) How does JS support Closures ?

4) What is Unobtrusive JavaScript and why its so popular ?

5) Is it necessary to add declarations in markup or templates to implement bindings in client side ?

6) Differences between Model Backed View and Markup Driven views ?

7) which should be fat in MVC model or controller ?

8) How does multiple controllers in JS MVC App are controlled?

If you answer these questions and score 80%, you will know what i am talking about.

P.S: If you want some, Come on get some :)

> If you feel my comment about Angular is completely Unfair, I agree with you and will delete it. But here is my argument.

I said a little, not completely, but we're all entitled to our opinions, that's why we're here :)

> 1) The code written in Angular javascript gets compiled into javascript.

I don't fully understand this - although I have only been using Angular for a few months - are you talking about my code in my controllers, views, services etc? because it doesn't seem to compile it and I can step through in browser developer tools. Or are you talking about the directives?

> 2) Tough to extend Angular and implement features that are not supported by Angular. Please Try adding new features on your own, then you will feel the pain.

Again, perhaps it's my use case, I haven't tried to add features to AngularJS but treated it as a dumb framework, adding my own libraries to perform localstorage, offline/online sync, custom view transitions etc. What have you had difficulty implementing?

> 3) Mixing bindings between the markup and script is not a good way to add bindings. Bindings should not be mixed with Markup (Unobtrusive JavaScript).

I agree with you here, however unless you're entirely building the DOM from scratch in JavaScript, you're probably going to work with HTML/CSS templating developers. I feel Angular gets the balance right of extending the templates with directives while not making the HTML generation completely opaque.

> 4) I felt Google is doing the same mistake they did with "GWT". They are not thinking in terms of issues faced by other JS developers, That is why jQuery is still pretty popular (Plugin based approach)

Maybe they are, however jQuery solved the problem of writing one set of JavaScript code which ran on all browsers, even though they all used different syntax (remember the old XHR JS?).

I see a lot of people use jQuery in a hamfisted attempt to modify the DOM without considering Layout/Reflow cycles and then they complain that their pages are clunky and slow to use.

I have an issue with client-side template engines which use handlebars/some other syntax because it's yet another templating engine that HTML developers have to learn, rather than just ... using HTML, which is already a standard.

> I worked on 4 applications with each having its own simplicity and complexity that uses Backbone. Never faced any issues, Community is very supportive.

I think that's great! It would be a very boring world if we were all the same.

> If you have done R&D on JS MVC and like Angular than Backbone JS (Ember JS always confuses me too), Please continue with your work. Because there is always a nicer way of doing things in Client side :).

I swore off writing frameworks a long time ago! :) There are a lot of people much cleverer than I, working on them, plus I much prefer working in the UI/DB area.

> P.S Here is one of my project in Backbone JS (https://github.com/pradeepin2/bbquiz)

Looks good. I think you may have a character encoding issue on one of the questions (it was the rearrange the letters one) I was getting ? ? letters in Chrome on my Mac (UK).

> Please share your toughts, Why you prefer Backbone JS over Angular JS ? It will be very helpful.

Today, I prefer Angular to all the other frameworks, but like I said I don't _want_ a massive library, I just want the routings/DOM manipulation to be handled for me and I can do the rest!

Having said that, if a new project came in tomorrow which was a perfect fit for what Backbone or Batman does, I would go for it. The right tool for the right job!

If Angular was to become a massive framework, I would probably ditch it or just use the parts I need.

I enjoy these discussions, especially when other people know more about a different library than I.

Most of whom? I came up in JS on the client-side. Nothing has been more frustrating over the years than watching all of the inflexible bloat and tightly coupled BS people have been piling on to the client-side in order to pretend it was something that it is not. Web forms sucked ass. Everything Java tried to do to pretend the client-side wasn't there has left massive legacy potholes all over the web. Just deal with the thing as it is already and learn something new. You're a programmer for chrissakes. I might indulge in writing OS apps with webkit but I don't try to add a server to the process if it's just a local desktop app in order to make it more like what I'm used to. HTML, CSS and JS properly applied are doing 4/5ths of what these frameworks are pointlessly reinventing. All you have to do is learn them properly. The rest, keeping data loosely coupled, is basic 'duh' OOP. All the stuff that's already there works surprisingly well if you actually give it a chance. Or have you not noticed that web technology solutions are spreading like wildfire into other domains or that we can implement and modify GUIs using client-side-web-technology a lot faster than desktop OS UI developers have ever been able to? FFS, they don't deliver on that desire because it's proven time and time again to be a complete waste of time to try to.

Are you replying to the correct person? I quite clearly stated JS was OO, whilst the GP clearly says that MV* frameworks "create an illusion of OOP".

If you're not convinced of the benefits of MV* frameworks on the client, please write a complex client-side app with vanilla JS and share what you learnt.

I'm being sincere there - I've tried, and I quickly started drowning in sea of boiler plate code I'd rather not have to write. Not that it's not fun to write some of that stuff, but I'd rather be delivering value. And what happens when I create a second app? Hmm seems there's lot of similar boiler plate stuff, why don't I just abstract that into a framewo.. oh wait

Yeah, I know this. You wouldn't be able to step through your code in browser dev tools otherwise.

The DOM manipulation stuff is one of the features which sold me on Angular. I love the idea that everything renders itself then responds to a single redraw event fired on the DOM so that reflow happens once rather than the hideous way many people use jQuery to do things like:

var div = $('div').appendTo('.home'); var ul = $('ul').appendTo(div); $('li').appendTo(ul);

Well done, each time you're causing layout.