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EmberJS Confuses Me

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Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#111

Post by davidw »

richo wrote: post #70

> I think Yehuda is a very nice and smart person I always get confused by this. I don't understand how being nice factors into technical decisions? (For the record, I also think wycats is nice, but I don't really care when I'm trying to decide whether or not what he's saying makes sense)

If you need help, want to suggest a modification, or otherwise need to interact with the author(s) of something you're using, it's nice to have friendly people to deal with, rather than assholes, all else being equal.

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#112

Post by WickyNilliams »

ganarajpr wrote: post #110
pradeepin wrote: post #96

Yes, I too agree EmberJS always a confusing library, Following are my resaons. 1)They say it follows MVC. Its actually MVC but MVP, if you look closely at the implementation. 2)Controller job is not precisely defined. Example: Even the data validations are done at controller level not a model level So i switched to Backbone.js, which is very flexible library with tons of plugins that can be used when needed. Since im…

Regarding AngularJS, please use it only if you are new javascript and prefer learning Angular Javascript (which is not javascript by the way) :) I am not sure you "know" javascript. If you are saying that there is an Angular version of javascript then you are terribly mistaken. Angular is probably one of the only mainstream framework that stays true to javascript. All other frameworks ( Backbone, Ember etc.. ) are th…

Before berating other people's knowledge, you should probably make sure that what you are saying is infallible. So with that I ask you:

Do you realise that JS is an object oriented language? Prototypes are a means for inheritance (i.e. reuse of code), just as classes are in more traditional languages - it does not mean JS is not OO.

My interpretation of the GP comment is that he means angular to JS is like jQuery to JS, it's effectively a DSL that you have to learn in itself. Someone once said "people don't write javascript anymore, they write jQuery". That's what I think he meant

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#113

Post by adamauckland »

pradeepin wrote: post #96

Yes, I too agree EmberJS always a confusing library, Following are my resaons. 1)They say it follows MVC. Its actually MVC but MVP, if you look closely at the implementation. 2)Controller job is not precisely defined. Example: Even the data validations are done at controller level not a model level So i switched to Backbone.js, which is very flexible library with tons of plugins that can be used when needed. Since im…

> Regarding AngularJS, please use it only if you are new javascript and prefer learning Angular Javascript

I'm not sure that's very fair to AngularJS. I gave up on Backbone and Ember because they had too many features, then later I was comparing JavaScript MVC patterns and stumbled across AngularJS which just made sense.

If what you mean by 'prefer learning Angular' is you have to understand $scope and $resource, $http etc, that's true of using anyone else's code, plus it's not exactly a massive library!

I'm genuinely curious why you think Angular _isn't_ Javascript?

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#114

Post by gosukiwi »

msarchet wrote: post #3
gosukiwi wrote: post #2

Well, I don't know EmberJS but for the handlebars code you showed, seems like the controller is somewhat more like a ViewModel (MVVM pattern), maybe learning KnockoutJS first would help a bit?

Rob has done knockout, and that's pretty unrelated I feel. I've spent a lot of time doing Knockout and a fair amount of time in Angular and Backbone, and personally I sort of agree with what rob is saying. I feel like they have taken MVC and just loosely applied it in Ember, because they have Models Views and Controllers. I see and understand where his confusion is coming from. I probably also haven't spent enough ti…

Well maybe it helps to wrap your mind around Ember controllers. From what I read, I'd rather use Backbone.

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#115

Post by nXqd »

The only reason is you are in love with AngularJS. I will find someone who really hates angularJS because if we have a lot of validation, it will become a messy of ng-*.

So no matter which framework we use, we should talk about real world project. Not simple usage that only exists in trying and testing.

Use the framework, you love and you will make it beautiful no matter what :D

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#116

Post by jonascopenhagen »

nXqd wrote: post #115

The only reason is you are in love with AngularJS. I will find someone who really hates angularJS because if we have a lot of validation, it will become a messy of ng-*. So no matter which framework we use, we should talk about real world project. Not simple usage that only exists in trying and testing. Use the framework, you love and you will make it beautiful no matter what :D

> I will find someone who really hates angularJS because if we have a lot of validation, it will become a messy of ng-*

Are you talking about HTML validation? AngularJS supports using data-ng-* which means it's valid HTML.

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#117

Post by tbatterii »

ffreire wrote: post #89
tonycoco wrote: post #61

Curious for yourself? Try following my simple starter app tutorial of Rails + Ember.js here: http://www.devmynd.com/blog/2013-3-rails-ember-js Though, I understand the pain of coming from a server-side MVC architecture, I found it refreshing that Ember.js takes the "desktop" MVC approach. Our web apps are now living on the client, acting like desktop apps. Most people struggle with this reverse at first, but can conc…

There seems to be some very positive buzz around this screencast mentioned both in the OP's blog and around HN in general: https://peepcode.com/products/emberjs . I found it particularly instructive but found that it only scratched the surface of this new framework. At least, it scratched enough off the top that I feel comfortable rooting through source and API documentation to figure out the rest. YMMV, of course.

i felt it did very well as an introduction. I think a deep dive into ember-data would be great for those who have been traditionally server side devs now getting into more of the client side stuff.

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#118

Post by floydpink »

nikcub wrote: post #94
rxcfc wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Ember teams has been planning for a sweep of all outdated information about Ember. We'll be updating SO questions and asking blog authors to add a disclaimer. Ember Data is a completely optional component of Ember that seeks to bring ORM-like abilities to the client side. It's not as far along or as stable as core Ember. For what it's worth, you can easily just use jQuery.ajax and create Ember.Objects from the re…

Since Ember 1.0 isn't compatible with Ember x.0 you could save yourself a lot of that work by sticking to semantic versioning and just calling it 'Ember2' I went through the same thing grandparent post did - a lot of old tutorials. I think it would be a good idea for Ember to make a complete break and to call this 1.0 release something else.

Semantic versioning states everything inthe public API should be considered unstable and changing until the major version is 1.

So whatever code samples are out there on blogs and SO were from the initial days of the API when it was changing a lot. I am with you and have been going through the pain of weeding out examples from the web that works with the latest version on GitHub. There were many methods that weren't even available in the current API.

Given the paradigm shifts with Router and the Controller, maybe what the Ember team needs to do now is to stop doing everything else and finish up on the documentation for their 1.0.0-rc.1 release before it is finalized to 1.0.0

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#119

Post by twinturbo »

terbanator wrote: post #42

Your examples are incorrect. The Route's model is set as the content of the controller, so all you need to say is #each item in content. Your model is set as the "content" of your controller, so your model is not "nowhere to be found"

content is wrong. You should be using controller. This works with arrangedContent. {{each content}} will not work with anything like SortableMixin.

Re: EmberJS Confuses Me

#120

Post by camwest »

wycats wrote: post #46
robconery wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems reasonable, but the Ember team sees it differently... they put state in the router : >Most of your controllers will be very small. Unlike other frameworks, where the state of your application is spread amongst many controllers, in Ember.js, we encapsulate that state in the router. This allows your controllers to be lightweight and focused on one thing.

In this case, the "state" that we're talking about is "what state are you in". In other words, the router manages high-level state ("I am looking at a post now"), and provides long-lived controllers with data reflecting that state. So even though there is information about the current state in the controller (and the view), the source of truth about the current high-level state is in the router.

I've found a more specific term than 'high-level' state to explain the router state is 'addressable state'. A single page web application has two types of state. Addressable state (which is stored in the Ember router) and then another form of state, let's call it non-addressable state which is stored in the controllers.

As an example you could have a web application that has multiple documents and inside each document there are panels that can be expanded and collapsed. As you switch between documents each document maintains its own version of which panels are expanded or collapsed.

In the Ember world the router would maintain which document was opened (addressable state) and the DocumentController would maintain which panels are opened (non-addressable state).

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