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LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

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Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#311

Post by lloyddobbler »

elemeno wrote: post #121
meerita wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're just claming to be the owners of the style, colors of his work. Meaning you cannot do something with Avenir and Helvetica font, combined with non-glassy graphycs. Something totally absurd, like saying I cannot make a framework inspired on X design movement. Check what the framework developer said: https://github.com/github/dmca/commit/735e17614cca63102b8414... "he said that he: "I am the exclusive rights hold…

They're not claiming to own the style or colours, they're claiming that some of illustrations used in FlatUI are illustrations that LayerVault owns the copyright to.

Right. And doing it in a vague way (not specifying WHICH illustrations they supposedly own the copyright to). Most of us who have looked at the illustrations side-by-side see their claim of owning copyright to be unfounded, for lots of reasons:

1) None of the illustrations in Flat UI are identical to LayerVault's illustrations. Derived works? Maybe. But under the law, that's okay.

2) Looking at illustrations from the Noun Project, and color palettes from Google and elsewhere, we see the same similarities that we do between LayerVault and Flat UI. If Flat UI is guilty of copyright infringement as LayerVault asserts, then LayerVault is most certainly guilty of copyright infringement from elsewhere.

3) Copyright isn't even the right legal vehicle for this debate. LayerVault could conceivably deem its icons to be trademarks, and show a likelihood of confusion when compared to Flat UI's icons. But LV using an icon set as a trademark would be unprecedented, and difficult to argue. (And even if that were the case, the Noun Project could just as easily claim LV infringed on their trademark.)

Overall, if LayerVault is claiming they own the copyright to illustrations used in Flat UI, they're flat-out wrong. And that's where the problem comes in - filing a fraudulent DMCA notice is bad business.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#312

Post by mynameisvlad »

etchalon wrote: post #244
ak217 wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Drew inspiration" is not proper justification for a DMCA notice. The fact that they're illegally misusing that law is why I'm walking away from this with a very negative opinion of LayerVault.

It is when it crosses the line into actual theft, which three of those icons apparently did.

Have you seen the icons so you can judge it for yourself?

I have. At best, it's inspired by the LV ones.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#313

Post by brendanobrien »

I think this serves as a great testimony to just how homogenous / under-considered the "flat" aesthetic has become. For crying out loud, flatUI is a kit for replicating this appearance! I love the flat look, but as soon as kits for replicating a look start to grow in popularity, it's time to move on.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#314

Post by dthunt »

lucisferre wrote: post #227
onemorepassword wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That looks pretty much open and shut, as if using a vague DMCA in itself wasn't already enough of a hint. It's not even a rip-off. The basic pattern for the icons is insanely generic, and the execution is clearly different. The color scheme is a very common one. It bears a resemblance as much as one black leather shoe bears a resemblance to another black leather shoe. It's not even worth making a passing remark about…

Give me a break. One single misguided DMCA notice does not make one a copyright troll .

It totally does. It means that you make an assertion you OWN something you didn't create.

That makes you the worst kind of troll out there, a knowingly lying one.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#315

Post by seakun »

ebbv wrote: post #86

Really glad I downloaded Flat UI yesterday before this crap started 'coz I'm gonna be using it for a project this weekend. Fortunately I only wanted the CSS. If an illustration was stolen (which seems unlikely, or at least it wasn't done with designmodo's knowledge), that won't affect me since I'm not using any of them.

Hi! Could I please also get a copy? sskung at cmu dot edu

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#316

Post by alexpenny »

chc wrote: post #231
alexpenny wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here are the icons in question. http://i.imgur.com/xDDULcG.png Also, the Flat-UI guy also copied other artists on dribbble. http://cl.ly/image/3Q181w0b1u2K From http://drbl.in/eXkk , and http://drbl.in/gmsD I'm not saying these are in copyright violation, merely examples he has copied prior work.

You're using a very weird definition of the word "copy." They are similar in that they depict a similar object from the same angle using a "flat" artistic style, but nobody is going to look at them side by side and mistake one for the other for even a second. This seems a bit like saying the iPhone is a copy of a slice of bread because they are both rectangular with few surface features. If you were asked to copy som…

False analogy. Comparing design work to carbohydrates is a thin argument.

Here is the definition of copy.. "A thing made to be similar or identical to another."

The worked linked to was not original. It is similar and identical to other designers work.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#317

Post by alexpenny »

milkshakes wrote: post #161
alexpenny wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here are the icons in question. http://i.imgur.com/xDDULcG.png Also, the Flat-UI guy also copied other artists on dribbble. http://cl.ly/image/3Q181w0b1u2K From http://drbl.in/eXkk , and http://drbl.in/gmsD I'm not saying these are in copyright violation, merely examples he has copied prior work.

You do understand that none of the examples you have posted are in fact examples of copyright violation right?

Yes I didn't say they were in copyright violation.

Here is the definition of copy.. "A thing made to be similar or identical to another."

The worked linked to was not original. It is similar and identical to other designers work.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#318

Post by dthunt »

Pyramids wrote: post #122
jgj wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A really good way to coerce the pitchforks back into their sheds is to provide proof, especially when your DMCA is vague and posted on a ridiculously public platform. Allan has done neither, and still hasn't done so in his tweets or this post over on his bubbly walled garden. A few simple side-by-side screenshots would have sufficed and put the court of public opinion squarely on his side. He may be completely in the…

Not to mention, he even says himself that it was " ... the similarities are a bit more than striking. That's not a huge issue until you release everything together - the icons, the colors, the UI elements, whatever." DMCA notices are to enforce against copyright infringement only, not as a tool for organizations to abuse in order to remove content which they think is "too similar", if this was the case, businesses wo…

Striking Similarity is the standard. While the standard there is not crystal clear, you expect to hear things like, 'hey, they have the same bug we do!' and 'is that one of our comments?!!'.

Web folks these days have some strange ideas about copyright, particularly as it relates to an overall 'site feel'. Unfortunately, this 'site feel' is not a single work, in the same way that you couldn't successfully keep others from making art in your 'style'.

The proper way to get a monopoly on a 'feel' is with one of those ridiculous design patents. That'd be inexcusable, because these patents mean nothing except that you intend to spend a lot of time making lawsuits based on poorly examined, impossibly wide patents.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#319

Post by b1daly »

deelowe wrote: post #308
jakelazaroff wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm less concerned with the allegations of copyright trolling, etc (IANAL; I don't really know whether or not this qualifies for a DMCA takedown notice, although I suspect it does not) and more with the general opinion among commentators here that this was anything OTHER than a blatant ripoff of LayerVault's UI. To me it seems like more of a trademark/trade dress issue, which as far as I know doesn't fall under copyr…

Ripping off someone's design isn't grounds for a DMCA takedown notice unless you actually violate copyright(the legal definition, not some hand wavy "I did it first" definition). If LV had filed a trademark claim no one would be complaining b/c A) they would definitely lose(there's no issue of brand confusion here) and B) the guy would get to decide himself whether he wanted to risk leaving his stuff online (instead…

One of problems with copyright is that the statute basically says you can't copy original works under certain conditions, but it doesn't define what constitutes copying. As far as I can figure out (IANAL) only a judge or jury can make that determination. You can try to figure out what has been considered copying by reading through other cases but it is not definitive until declared so by a court.

Re: LayerVault Sends DMCA Takedown Letter re Flat-UI

#320

Post by awolf »

alexpenny wrote: post #316
chc wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're using a very weird definition of the word "copy." They are similar in that they depict a similar object from the same angle using a "flat" artistic style, but nobody is going to look at them side by side and mistake one for the other for even a second. This seems a bit like saying the iPhone is a copy of a slice of bread because they are both rectangular with few surface features. If you were asked to copy som…

False analogy. Comparing design work to carbohydrates is a thin argument. Here is the definition of copy.. "A thing made to be similar or identical to another." The worked linked to was not original. It is similar and identical to other designers work.

>A thing made to be similar or identical to another.

So... couldn't we argue that LayerVault copied the design of actual clocks? Using your logic, the inventor of the wall clock would be just as justified sending LayerVault a take-down notice, right?

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