I note that the original InfoWorld article is 3 months old. In the comments here one person has said that they still see the deletion and two say that they don't.
So, does anyone else have test results to report?
Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
261–270 of 395 posts
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#262Earlier quoted context omitted.
So this implies there is a market for a simple mailserver that just mimics gmail (or whatever) on your own server: e.g. apt-get install gmail-server
Search is IMO the hard part. I know you can do Lucerne, but getting that working well with email is hard. Until recently Outlook's search was crap compared to gmail. too, and mutt is still essentially "headers only". Still, shouldn't be that hard to do as long as it is your own server and you trust it; I imagine a lot of the difficulty of gmail is scaling, and even a single user with 20-50GB of mail isn't in the same…
notmuch for search.
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#263Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is wrong. It goes beyond this. There are various clear examples of Apple exercising far too much authority. It's not a question of whether you should use certain products. It becomes a question of whether you should trust Apple at all.
You shouldn't trust any company. Not Apple, not Microsoft, and not Google. Which is why "the cloud" is a stupid idea.
Which is why "the cloud" is a stupid idea.
People said the same thing about the internet and insisted that only direct-dial communications made any sense. This is one of those cases where I think the market will take care of things.
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#264Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's very very problematic. With all the spam, your mail server is not going to be trusted by any major providers. Their weak heuristics have no problem banning your 1 user mailserver, but they have gmail whitelisted to not ever ban them.
Agreed, this is the biggest barrier to running your own mailserver. Even if you think deliverability is good for 95% of mail servers there's always some ISP that won't cater for you. So you're constantly having to be monitoring the logs to ensure your emails are being delivered.
Working professionally for a small company, which provide emails service for customers domains, i can say that this has never happen for us. not a single time.
Sometimes people get hacked, either because they pick a abc123 password (nowdays blocked by policy), or because a customer webserver CMS theme has not been updated in the last 2 years. When that happen, a few mail servers (mostly yahoo) has temp banned mails for a few hours. Mails still got delivered however.
So lesson to learn there is to not use passwords like abc123, and to actually update that 2 year old CMS theme. Or you don't combine webserver with webmail.
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#265Earlier quoted context omitted.
In my experience, it is not so much the installation itself, but the regular maintenance and the many subtle errors that can occur, which make running your own email server NOT as trivial as you make it sound :). As for a few examples: 1. Mailservers around the world have different degrees of strictness in what they accept. Some require the sender’s mailserver to have a valid and matching PTR and A/AAAA (!) DNS recor…
Have to agree with this. I ran my own mail server for a few years and even though set up was easy, deliverability was a PITA (I was never able to successfully deliver to hotmail addresses even after doing everything possible on my end). Then there's spam.. what a headache. Suddenly one day I realised that I have better things to do with my time and now everything goes through google servers.
Did you install greylisting and blacklisting? It really do reduce spam to ~0, and is a one time 5-20m configuration.
As for hotmail, I strongly remember doing a telnet to hotmail servers and succeeded in sending emails while writing commands by hand on my private computer. Thus without any special headers or other magic, I could send email without any issues. It would had been interesting to hear details on why hotmail rejected your emails. Default postfix installation?
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#266Earlier quoted context omitted.
Search is IMO the hard part. I know you can do Lucerne, but getting that working well with email is hard. Until recently Outlook's search was crap compared to gmail. too, and mutt is still essentially "headers only". Still, shouldn't be that hard to do as long as it is your own server and you trust it; I imagine a lot of the difficulty of gmail is scaling, and even a single user with 20-50GB of mail isn't in the same…
> and mutt is still essentially "headers only" Mutt is more like "everything I can come up with from the command line." Sure, I won't make my grandma use it, but I've never needed any searching capability beyond grep and co.
Yeah, I end up grepping organized-by-years Maildirs, but that's somewhat suboptimal.
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#267Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sadly, there's a very real possibility that this could happen as Nanny Computing (anyone coined a better term?) is proving to be quite profitable.
The switch from x86 to ARM for their entire computing line -- if it happens, as has been rumored -- will be what closes the door on power users.
What is Apple going to use for their own work? Their developers and designers are power users.
It's certainly possible that the Macbook Air would switch to ARM in the next few years, but until you can write software for an iPad on an iPad, there's no getting away from OS X and serious processors.
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#268Earlier quoted context omitted.
In my experience, it is not so much the installation itself, but the regular maintenance and the many subtle errors that can occur, which make running your own email server NOT as trivial as you make it sound :). As for a few examples: 1. Mailservers around the world have different degrees of strictness in what they accept. Some require the sender’s mailserver to have a valid and matching PTR and A/AAAA (!) DNS recor…
Don't forget maintenance of the hardware itself, backups, and everything else that comes with running a server (assuming you didn't buy one in the cloud).
> assuming you didn't buy one in the cloud
Buying a mail server in the cloud is the most practical option. I doubt EC2 would peek inside your VM to censor mail as Apple is doing here.
Running a mail server at home can get complicated. Other than having to manage the hardware yourself, there are limitations on residential internet connections. Not only do residential ISP often provide dynamic IP addresses, they tend to block port 25 (at least outgoing) so as to counter spambots. Some spam filter may also treat mail delivered from your home server more harshly.
Though, if you really can't trust anyone (cloud providers, SMTP relays, or the network in general) you're be better of using PGP.
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#269Earlier quoted context omitted.
As trivial as it may be, I consider it censorship when they stop being transparent. Displaying "Blocked!" when someone tries to access the site is, as you said, totally their business. Implying a successful HTTP connection but a missing file? Still, as you said, inconsequential. The attitude that leads someone to make it look like a 404 instead of a blocked site? That's the same attitude that makes them block emails…
404 is an accurate statement by the browser when the distinct hosts file maps xmission.com to localhost. A 503 error would be a forged response. 404 is the expected type of response with two separate modularized/encapsulated systems where the browser merely reports that it found nothing from the typed in URL. Saying that the site is "blocked" would involve creating a special facility just for this purpose. I don't th…
Thank you for the clarification - I stand corrected!
Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'
#270Earlier quoted context omitted.
> and mutt is still essentially "headers only" Mutt is more like "everything I can come up with from the command line." Sure, I won't make my grandma use it, but I've never needed any searching capability beyond grep and co.
Yeah, I end up grepping organized-by-years Maildirs, but that's somewhat suboptimal.
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