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Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

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Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#101

Post by mikeash »

rayiner wrote: post #96
mikeash wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"True Apple fashion" has only recently been about resisting power users. Before about five years ago, they were all about enabling power users while still being friendly to regular people. This was much more compelling than their current direction. Remember, this is the company that built their OS on top of UNIX and shipped a terminal app with it standard . It all changed around when the iPhone came out, though.

Counter narrative: nothing has changed. Apple has just expanded their business. If Apple made toasters, whether they were locked down or not wouldn't affect my opinion of what was likely to happen to my Mac. iPhones are toasters, not computers.

I can buy the idea that iOS being locked down doesn't tell you what's likely to happen to your Mac. But once Apple started bringing iOS-like features across, then it becomes pretty reasonable to compare the two to guess at what they might do next.

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#102

Post by cryptoz »

Too wrote: post #94
scott_s wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's so surprising I tried to find evidence of it online, but I couldn't. Partly because "index.php" is such a common thing that Google won't use it for a search term, which is ironic. Can you point to anything corroborating that?

I think that's supposed to be download.php, not index.php. At least that's what I've experienced. (this was several years ago btw)

Hm, maybe it was download.php. Now I'm not sure.

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#103

Post by nodata »

taligent wrote: post #82
nodata wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple does actually know how to run web services. No, Apple can run a centralised download store where the content comes from a limited number of sources.

Which is an example of a web service. Are you sure you're on the right web site ?

It's a category of web service. Other examples are services which take huge numbers of photos from lots of different users and process them, or files from millions of devices for backup. These Apple cannot do well.

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#104

Post by rayiner »

mikeash wrote: post #101
rayiner wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Counter narrative: nothing has changed. Apple has just expanded their business. If Apple made toasters, whether they were locked down or not wouldn't affect my opinion of what was likely to happen to my Mac. iPhones are toasters, not computers.

I can buy the idea that iOS being locked down doesn't tell you what's likely to happen to your Mac. But once Apple started bringing iOS-like features across, then it becomes pretty reasonable to compare the two to guess at what they might do next.

OS X and iOS share a lot of the same core code base, so of course there is going to be cross-pollination features-wise. Why should the migration of features to solve problems common to both platforms indicate you should start worrying about Apple locking down the Mac?

Guess what: when Macs get touch screens, more Launchpad is going to make more sense, and full screen is going to be even better. That doesn't mean that Apple is going to start locking down the Mac. Indeed, as time goes on and their less technical users migrate to iOS instead, they have even less incentive to further lock down the Mac.

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#105

Post by skore »

roc wrote: post #67
mikeash wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"True Apple fashion" has only recently been about resisting power users. Before about five years ago, they were all about enabling power users while still being friendly to regular people. This was much more compelling than their current direction. Remember, this is the company that built their OS on top of UNIX and shipped a terminal app with it standard . It all changed around when the iPhone came out, though.

While we're keeping history in context, let's also not forget this is also the company that was borderline irrelevant prior to their current direction.

I got a 17" Macbook Pro in 2009 (when they were still riding the wave of the iPhone) because it was a solid piece of hardware and gave me a sweet spot of down-the-road-choice (I exchanged the cd bay with another hdd, added Ram, installed Linux). I was looking forward to buying further Macbooks in the future.

All that was shattered with their new Macbook lineup (which are pretty much just beefier MB Airs). They flat out killed the 17" (which I still consider the perfect on-the-go workstation).

I considered Apple very relevant around the iPhone release. The current direction is not the iPhone direction. It is the iPad direction. That's when they started to go somewhat batshit on driving away professional users. They could have maintained both camps pretty handily in my opinion. Both camps were quite happy and got along great. Why they decided to kill off one is beyond me. Sure, there is more money in everyday clients, but I doubt they were actually hurting their business with power users.

Consider this: When I - a staunch defender of FOSS, user of Kubuntu, Free Software programmer, ardent antagonist of everything Microsoft - got my Macbook, I actually started recommending Macs as a choice to others. It actually did seem to me a better choice than going with Microsoft Windows. These days, I recommend Windows 7.

That's what they have accomplished.

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#106

Post by taligent »

mikeash wrote: post #85
taligent wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple does actually know how to run web services. They run the world's largest media store and one of the world's busiest online stores in addition to iCloud. Just because MobileMe was a piece of junk doesn't mean they are completely clueless.

Their media stores take hours, sometimes a day, to propagate metadata changes. Any time an App Store app gets released or updated, there's a fun game where you watch it slowly propagate to visibility among your friends and acquaintances. Their store for physical goods goes down every time they make a significant change to the product offerings. Both are highly successful , but all this tells us is that a web service…

>Their store for physical goods goes down every time they make a significant change to the product offerings.

Many years ago it used to go down for technical reasons.

Now it is purely PR/Marketing. They get massive traffic spikes whenever it goes up and it instantly results in thousands of web pages going up with free PR. Why would you give that up ?

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#108

Post by nsmartt »

rayiner wrote: post #86
nsmartt wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is wrong. It goes beyond this. There are various clear examples of Apple exercising far too much authority. It's not a question of whether you should use certain products. It becomes a question of whether you should trust Apple at all.

You shouldn't trust any company. Not Apple, not Microsoft, and not Google. Which is why "the cloud" is a stupid idea.

>You shouldn't trust any company. Not Apple, not Microsoft, and not Google

Agreed. It's very difficult to convey this point, however. People don't really listen once you say these sorts of things. Even if they do, they don't change the way they work with those companies. This is especially true with Facebook. I've shown a lot of scary practices of Facebook to various people. All agree that Facebook is therefore pretty dangerous but continue to use it on a daily basis.

>"the cloud" is a stupid idea.

I do take issue with "the cloud" regarding the issues of your things not belonging to you, privacy issues, etc. There are benefits to e.g. hosting providers. I also would love Dropbox if my files were encrypted and impossible to view by staff.

The bottom line is that we need more companies who insure privacy rather than just claiming to respect it even though they store large quantities of personal information. Other such companies should work to avoid vendor lock-in.

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#109

Post by rayiner »

mikeash wrote: post #98
rayiner wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the use-cases for phones and macs are exactly the same! Because there is no valid use-case for GateKeeper other than Apple wanting to control every piece of software on your machine. Because Apple totally doesn't care if third-party developers jump ship from their platform because the developer tools are locked down. Because paranoia is so much more fun than rational thought.

Excuse me. I only meant to point out that Apple already has a platform where they control every piece of software on your machine, and so it's not absurd to think that they might try to do this on their other platform. I don't think my post merits your implication that I'm not thinking rationally.

I don't think jumping to that conclusion is any more rational than worrying about the Mustang getting watered down based on Ford's releasing a new Fiesta. Even if Ford does share Fiesta door handle parts with the new Mustangs.

Re: Apple’s Deleting iCloud Emails That Contain The Phrase 'Barely Legal Teens'

#110

Post by taligent »

jonknee wrote: post #99
mikeash wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their media stores take hours, sometimes a day, to propagate metadata changes. Any time an App Store app gets released or updated, there's a fun game where you watch it slowly propagate to visibility among your friends and acquaintances. Their store for physical goods goes down every time they make a significant change to the product offerings. Both are highly successful , but all this tells us is that a web service…

> Their store for physical goods goes down every time they make a significant change to the product offerings. That still amazes me. No wonder why WebObjects never took off...

WebObjects never took off because of pricing.

And by the time they ported it to Java there were plenty of open source alternatives.

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