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Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

jacquesmattheij.com

181–190 of 242 posts

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It should have defaulted to 'off'. You can break trust exactly once.

It's a free service and they're at the point where monetization is becoming a necessity. I can appreciate that, and it's not a particularly evil way of doing it, if you ask me. I don't know about you, but I can live with a couple of non-obtrusive links that go other places—especially since, like a lot of people, I got emails about it ahead of time. If you can't, you can turn it off. You act as if the ads are putting…

I wouldn't have downvoted except for this nice piece of well-poisoning:

> You act as if the ads are putting ugly pictures of fat people are flooding your site

Not to mention the fact that his argument had nothing to do with what was being advertised.

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#182

I have to disagree even as someone relying on Disqus in a few different ways. First off, they did provide notice. I received an email about this at all the addresses I have an account under. Maybe the the author didn't and that sucks but this seems like an edge case and he is one of the exceptions, not the rule. Second, you can turn this feature off which brings me to my next point. Even if they do decide to change t…

> they did provide notice I can confirm they contact me as well. On 12/11/12, they sent me an email titled "Growing with Disqus". However, 1) Gmail auto-labeled it as "Promotions", so I didn't read it. Not disqus' fault, just saying. 2) The text is shady; never does it mention specifically that ads will be placed on your site, but dances around the issue before finally saying "if you'd rather not try this feature, yo…

The message being labeled with "Promotions" is as the result of a filter you created, right?

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A great idea. Can you paste your list here? I'd like to add it to my hosts file.

sure, 127.0.0.1 disqus.com 127.0.0.1 www.disqus.com 127.0.0.1 mediadcn.disqus.com 127.0.0.1 parsley.com I also use a slightly modified hosts file from here: http://someonewhocares.org/hosts/ it does a pretty good job of cutting out the crap but I had to add things to get rid of any facebook links, disqus links, etc...

Thank-you.

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#184
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi Daniel, why was it not opt-in? You describe it as a "revenue sharing" program, but did not ask your customers if they wanted to be part of it. You assumed their silence meant that they did.

Because that's how most options that are likely to make money are rolled out these days. Disqus are not the only one using these tactics. I can't find the link the anti-patterns video/site, I'm sure someone will know the one I am talking about. But it's things like pre-selecting paid for delivery options, adding travel insurance to flight cost etc etc to drive up costs but then make it not obvious how to remove those…

This is a different kind of sleezy. Adding travel insurance to a flight happens before the user has agreed to the deal. In this case Disqus has hundreds of thousands of people signed up for a commenting system and then changed the product fundamentally without asking them if they want this new product. That's exactly why it is (correctly) described as a bait-and-switch.

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#185
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way are they not acceptable? They are totally acceptable to me. They provide a great service for free and now they want to monetize it with ads, shocking! I think it's extremely generous and quite remarkable of them to offer both a cut and an option to opt-out. They should be rewarded for that, not blamed. I think the sense of entitlement you have knowing that disqus offered you a great and free service for y…

If I offer to paint your house for free, and I do a good job of it but also steal your TV, you actually are entitled to be upset and even call the cops. You can't say, "Hey, I was working for free, and now I want to monetize it with his TV. He's acting so entitled, like I need to ask if it's OK first." (Obviously I'm not saying they stole anyone's TV, but more extreme examples demonstrate the flaws in an idea better…

That's a poor analogy and even you have pointed it out. So using it only creates an unnecessary and invalid connection between stealing and what disqus did.

To be fair, "I can do whatever I want" was actually the condition GP pointed out. As other users have pointed out, this was not a surprise to most of them as they were notified about it.

> they still have every right to be unhappy

Yes They do. But they don't have the right to call the other party malicious.

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#186
Interesting. I was wondering what is going on with the flagging of this article, it is much lower in the ranking than you'd expect looking at the age and the accrued points. It took me a while to find that disqus is a YC company, so that's why there are so many flags.

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#187
post #10

"If you aren't paying for the product/service then you are the product/service being sold." EDIT: Wow. Why the downvotes? Do people still not understand this saying? I understand it hurts if/when you get burned but it shouldn't come as a surprise when free services change to something less desirable to monetize their business models. I wouldn't be surprised if they soon offer paid "premium" accounts that don't show a…

Does this quote have an origin?

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they did provide notice I can confirm they contact me as well. On 12/11/12, they sent me an email titled "Growing with Disqus". However, 1) Gmail auto-labeled it as "Promotions", so I didn't read it. Not disqus' fault, just saying. 2) The text is shady; never does it mention specifically that ads will be placed on your site, but dances around the issue before finally saying "if you'd rather not try this feature, yo…

The message being labeled with "Promotions" is as the result of a filter you created, right?

It's the new smart labels feature. It's automatic.

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> advertising (we call it Promoted Discovery) Oh, come on, you guys are better than this.

Have you seen Twitter's "Sponsored Tweets", Facebook's "Sponsored Stories", Amazon's "Inspired by your browsing history". Ditching the word "advertising" is nothing new and we all use sites like these every day.

"Recommended content" is very different from "Sponsored Stories". Also sponsored means to pay for advertising.

"Inspired by your browsing history" are not ads. It is exactly what it says.

Re: Disqus bait and switch, now with ads

#190
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I offer to paint your house for free, and I do a good job of it but also steal your TV, you actually are entitled to be upset and even call the cops. You can't say, "Hey, I was working for free, and now I want to monetize it with his TV. He's acting so entitled, like I need to ask if it's OK first." (Obviously I'm not saying they stole anyone's TV, but more extreme examples demonstrate the flaws in an idea better…

That's a poor analogy and even you have pointed it out. So using it only creates an unnecessary and invalid connection between stealing and what disqus did. To be fair, "I can do whatever I want" was actually the condition GP pointed out. As other users have pointed out, this was not a surprise to most of them as they were notified about it. > they still have every right to be unhappy Yes They do. But they don't have…

> That's a poor analogy and even you have pointed it out.

No, I pointed out why it's a perfectly fine analogy ("more extreme examples demonstrate the flaws in an idea better than more subtle ones").

When drawing an analogy, the things need only be similar in the areas being compared. In fact, the more dissimilar they are in other respects, the better, because the whole point of an analogy is to show how similar features behave in different contexts.

For example, if you put forward the proposition, "OJ Simpson is violent because he is black," I might respond by pointing to other well-known black men such as Martin Luther King, who was clearly not violent and is pretty well known as a good person. This does not mean I'm equating OJ Simpson and Martin Luther King in any respect other than their race — in fact, the differences between the men are at the heart of the comparison. They are similar in the aspect being compared (race), but otherwise unlike each other in nearly every way possible.

If any dissimilarity invalidated an analogy in the way you seem to believe, analogy would be altogether impossible because things could only ever be compared to themselves.

> So using it only creates an unnecessary and invalid connection between stealing and what disqus did.

No, it doesn't! I posted a fairly long parenthetical specifically explaining this. Please take the time to read and think about what you've read before replying in the future. It is very annoying to have to explain this over and over.

Again, the difference between the two actions is at the heart of the analogy. Obviously you'll agree that the painter who steals the TV is in the wrong. Nobody thinks it's OK to steal your customer's stuff. The point is that the same justification — he offered a free service, so he is entitled to monetize it in ways that affect you without telling you and you have no right to complain — would appear to apply to the painter's actions. Thus, it is a weak justification. That was my point.

> Yes They do. But they don't have the right to call the other party malicious.

ctrl-F malic -> 0 results

Uh, cool?

I don't think anybody is calling Disqus malicious. Malice is intent to injure someone, and there's no evidence that Disqus was actively seeking to hurt people. I think the accusation here is that the way Disqus has behaved is inconsiderate and sneaky.

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