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Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#21

Post by yamada »

shiro wrote: post #18

It is, actually, pretty difficult to judge whether a group is a (destructive) cult or not only by what the leader or its members are saying or how the group is working. The border is pretty blurry. I learned it in hard way (by tring to save a friend from one). A good test (though not perfect) is to look at the output of the group---is the group producing outcome that contribute to the society at large? Are the people…

Well, that's hard to say - many cults actually make associations with successful people and then claim that their success is based on the influence/teachings of the cult. I'm sure some people think scientology is a cult (it is in the process of being declared criminal in some EU member states) and Sky Dayton seems to be doing ok. And of course, the trickiest part is that the group always claims that its output is beneficial and if you don't understand how it is, well then that's why you need the group to explain it to you.

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#22

Post by nostrademons »

dfranke wrote: post #17
nostrademons wrote: post #14

Next up: Is your job the next Aum Shinrikyo? Zealous focus on charismatic leadership to whom inner-circle members display unquestioning commitment? "Yes, Mr. CEO, the numbers all add up. I'll have those reports for you in a moment." Members required to relocate in order to increase dependency on the group? "No telecommuting for you!" Preoccupation with bringing in new members? "We're hiring! Tell all your friends! Yo…

Don't feed the trolls.

But they're so amusing!

Oh hell, I've got startup to work on, that's more fun anyways.

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#23

Post by yamada »

bluishgreen wrote: post #16

This reminded me of my uncle's dog. You should have seen it chase its tail. when I first saw it, it was very funny. But then it quickly became the saddest thing I ever saw. It would chase its tail for hours till it became exhausted. My uncle explained that it was imagining its tail to be some snake that caught on to it. The dog had imagination, except it was paranoid. It died a few months later exhausted, bitter and…

Someone should report you to the ASPCA for neglecting your lonely dog. Shame on you!

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#24

Post by aswanson »

dfranke wrote: post #17
nostrademons wrote: post #14

Next up: Is your job the next Aum Shinrikyo? Zealous focus on charismatic leadership to whom inner-circle members display unquestioning commitment? "Yes, Mr. CEO, the numbers all add up. I'll have those reports for you in a moment." Members required to relocate in order to increase dependency on the group? "No telecommuting for you!" Preoccupation with bringing in new members? "We're hiring! Tell all your friends! Yo…

Don't feed the trolls.

Amen, dfranke.

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#25

Post by dood »

It is possible to percieve very many things as cult-like, especially if you try to imagine how people will look at them in, say, 200 years (e.g. fashion, university, jobs, using drugs, not using drugs, being a sportsfan, being a nerd, following societal norms, constantly quoting the big lebowski, etc. etc.). Play along by looking at people's lives and beliefs throughout history, and try to work out who were the least culty.

The conclusion I came to is that it it generally best to work things out for yourself, and rarely bad to question your assumptions.

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#27

Post by shiro »

yamada wrote: post #21
shiro wrote: post #18

It is, actually, pretty difficult to judge whether a group is a (destructive) cult or not only by what the leader or its members are saying or how the group is working. The border is pretty blurry. I learned it in hard way (by tring to save a friend from one). A good test (though not perfect) is to look at the output of the group---is the group producing outcome that contribute to the society at large? Are the people…

Well, that's hard to say - many cults actually make associations with successful people and then claim that their success is based on the influence/teachings of the cult. I'm sure some people think scientology is a cult (it is in the process of being declared criminal in some EU member states) and Sky Dayton seems to be doing ok. And of course, the trickiest part is that the group always claims that its output is ben…

Yes, that's why I said it's not perfect. The thing is, to some people, the cult's methodology works for their success (since many mind-control techniques are not evil by themselves, and can be used to improve one's life if used wisely).

You have to look at not only those successful cases, but also the rest of cases---if the group has contributed to the success of a few celebrities, but not for the 99.9% of other members, then the success cases are likely to be by chance rather than the real result of the cult.

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#28

Post by dood »

shiro wrote: post #27
yamada wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's hard to say - many cults actually make associations with successful people and then claim that their success is based on the influence/teachings of the cult. I'm sure some people think scientology is a cult (it is in the process of being declared criminal in some EU member states) and Sky Dayton seems to be doing ok. And of course, the trickiest part is that the group always claims that its output is ben…

Yes, that's why I said it's not perfect. The thing is, to some people, the cult's methodology works for their success (since many mind-control techniques are not evil by themselves, and can be used to improve one's life if used wisely). You have to look at not only those successful cases, but also the rest of cases---if the group has contributed to the success of a few celebrities, but not for the 99.9% of other memb…

A better test may be simply: does the belief/practice lead to health and happiness for the practitioners, and those they affect and interact with?

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#29

Post by yamada »

shiro wrote: post #27
yamada wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's hard to say - many cults actually make associations with successful people and then claim that their success is based on the influence/teachings of the cult. I'm sure some people think scientology is a cult (it is in the process of being declared criminal in some EU member states) and Sky Dayton seems to be doing ok. And of course, the trickiest part is that the group always claims that its output is ben…

Yes, that's why I said it's not perfect. The thing is, to some people, the cult's methodology works for their success (since many mind-control techniques are not evil by themselves, and can be used to improve one's life if used wisely). You have to look at not only those successful cases, but also the rest of cases---if the group has contributed to the success of a few celebrities, but not for the 99.9% of other memb…

So then how do you distinguish that? Like does YCombinator method make people succeed? Or is it good at identifying likely future successes and convincing them to associate with YCombinator? Or both? How do you gage the effect either way? In other words, does YC make the successes, or is it better at systematically finding them and associating with them?

Re: Is Y Combinator the next Aum Shinrikyo?

#30

Post by shiro »

dood wrote: post #28
shiro wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that's why I said it's not perfect. The thing is, to some people, the cult's methodology works for their success (since many mind-control techniques are not evil by themselves, and can be used to improve one's life if used wisely). You have to look at not only those successful cases, but also the rest of cases---if the group has contributed to the success of a few celebrities, but not for the 99.9% of other memb…

A better test may be simply: does the belief/practice lead to health and happiness for the practitioners, and those they affect and interact with?

Unfortunately, you can make people subjectively happy by mind-control techniques. Being healthy is also difficult to define (to some extent).
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