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"Most of you steal your software"

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Re: "Most of you steal your software"

#121
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not advocate piracy, and do believe that people should be paid for their work. However, you are wrong. Theft means that the original owner no longer has the item stolen from them. Copying something from them most definitely leaves them with the original. That is one way in which piracy is not like theft. I would much rather someone download a copy of my code, than grab all my drives, make a copy, erase them, the…

Having read threads on this subject for 20 years, the same old tired points get brought up as if they matter whatsoever. Nobody cares about the semantic arguments. People are arguing that you should not pirate software and that if you do you should be viewed by your peers as someone on par with a thief since you have the same moral code as a thief does, you just choose to perform immoral acts in a medium that is most…

Do you then think that these people of disreputable character regularly steal from their local grocery stores? Or at least, that they have no moral qualms about doing that, as it's the same as copyright infringement, and the only reason they don't is the increased risk?

Re: "Most of you steal your software"

#122
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As soon as the straw man steps in, I have to step out. Good conversation, but I think we are not gonna see eye to eye here.

For those of us following along from home: Care to point out the strawman?

Technological innovation in a competitive free market has nothing to do with the original point. Meh, I'm over it. At the end of the day, I feel that copyright infringement is stealing, and other people don't. I am fine with a legal distinction, but I see no such distinction from a layman's moral standpoint.

Re: "Most of you steal your software"

#123
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those of us following along from home: Care to point out the strawman?

Technological innovation in a competitive free market has nothing to do with the original point. Meh, I'm over it. At the end of the day, I feel that copyright infringement is stealing, and other people don't. I am fine with a legal distinction, but I see no such distinction from a layman's moral standpoint.

> I feel that copyright infringement is stealing

But laws and policy aren't about feelings; they rely on consistent and precise definitions of terms.

If anything here is a strawman, it's your insistence on equivocating two behaviors which are substantively and observably different in their intentions, methods, and effects, in order to apply the moral censure earned by one disingenuously to the other.

If you want to make a meaningful argument against copyright infringement in its own right, please do so; I'd welcome the productive discourse. But arguing against it by calling it calling it by the name of another thing entirely - without bothering to establish a coherent connection between the two - doesn't constitute a valid argument in the slightest.

Further, my previous comment involved nothing resembling a strawman at all; you offered the position that copyright ought to be protected in order to ensure that the time and labor input into the initial design of a creative work would always yield a return for the creator, and I replied by pointing out that these are capital expenditures, to which no one in any field is entitled a guaranteed return at all.

Do you seriously regard as a strawman my classification of the advance investments necessary to open a factory and the advance investments necessary to produce a film both as capital expenditures, but simultaneously claim that your equivocation of copyright infringement with stealing is a robust and substantive assertion?

> I see no such distinction from a layman's moral standpoint

Then why do so many "laymen" actively assert this distinction?

Again, I have to point out that your methods of discourse actively reduce the credibility of your position.

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