I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
261–270 of 298 posts
Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#262Earlier quoted context omitted.
Like, we couldn't use a chunk of that 200K here in the US to fix our bulging deficit. This is why we have it.
The full $200,000 would cover, literally, 1.8 seconds of federal government spending.
Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#263.
"PayPal has closed my account because I don’t have a social security number. It seems like I don’t qualify for one because I’m just “an international student” from Venezuela."
I just don't believe this one bit. People from Venezuela do use PayPal quite a bit.
More likely what this is actually about is that you haven't done the minimum to do business in America, which PayPal told you up front that they expected you to do.
They're not actually able to do business with you, because you haven't taken the correct steps yet. If you say "oh my god they're punishing me for being from the wrong country," you're screwed.
But if you figure out the problem, you can fix it.
Here's the thing. In America, like in Venezuela and most of the rest of the world, you're expected to pay taxes on money transfer. It's an income stream.
The social security number is how Americans track these things in their private lives. Sure, you won't get one because you're not American, but there are foreign equivalents, and they're cheap. We do want to do business with you; you just have to be clean.
PayPal can't give you your money until you do what the US Government requires. It would be illegal. It would make them into a criminal money laundering organization.
I'm not really sure; I'm no tax attorney. But, I think what you want is an ITIN - an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number. They are free, they're available online, and they only take a couple weeks to get.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Taxpayer_Identificat...
http://www.irs.gov/Individuals/International-Taxpayers/Taxpa...
http://www.irs.gov/Individuals/International-Taxpayers/Obtai...
It's very common in the tech community for people to hear "PayPal shut off an account? They're the devil!" But in reality, this is how America keeps its money from flowing to criminal organizations, and PayPal's hands are tied here.
If you took the time to talk to them, and said "listen, I didn't know there was a problem, can you help me understand what steps I need to take to get this turned around," it's very likely they'll actually help you, like they helped me.
The toxic Redditor behavior is getting out of control. Not every time a large company does something that seems punitive is it actually in the wrong, and in this situation, they're really just following the law. That's expected. That's correct.
Also, to put things in perspective, you seem to be frustrated that you have to wait six months to receive five years of an average American's salary. I mean, I don't think this is actually as bad as you're making it out to be, unless you've tied your entire life to taking money from the internet, and can't survive without it.
I think maybe you should consider the possibility of asking some of your users for a little spare cash through some crowdfunding site (full disclosure: I work for a crowdfunding site, which is why I'm not naming options right now, because it would be unethical.)
And then maybe just try to work with PayPal to fix the problem, instead of begging the internet to try to hammer-lock PayPal into breaking the law for you, because no matter how hard you try, that is never, ever going to work.
Try setting up a Google Voice account, and calling them on the phone. If they can hear your fear in your voice, the human will to do good and help will come out, and they will put in effort to assist. I promise. That's just how people work.
Also consider getting in contact with the American tax authority, the IRS. It's pretty common for people to hate and fear them, but they're actually wonderful people; their big job is to prevent rich people from cheating the system, and to support poor people, and your story is very sympathetic. Someone from the IRS will, if you just ask, put in hours and hours to try to help you, for free. That's what they do for a living.
You can choose to assume everyone's evil and out to get you, or you can choose to assume that you accidentally didn't get the rules right, and that fixing that could change things.
Which one of those assumptions you make will very significantly change the outcome you get.
There is a reason that people who expect good things from other people generally do well in life. They're able to ask for, and receive, more help. Bad things are fixed more reliably. Et cetera.
Just make a human appeal. "I didn't know I screwed up. I still don't know how. I earned this money legitimately, and I need it. Can you help me learn what I did wrong, so that I can fix it?"
Give them a chance to be good - maybe even a couple - and they will be good.
PayPal is not the evil faceless demon they're made out to be. International payments are complicated, and people from other countries often get domestic law wrong.
But I really don't think they want to cheat you; after all, they make their money by helping you do more business. Shutting you off doesn't do them any good.
Please consider approaching this like you might have made a mistake, because if it's you, and not them, then fixing it and changing this is entirely inside your power. Taking responsibility means acquiring power. Pointing fingers weakens you.
I hope the best for your situation. Please be safe.
Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#264Wow, the sheer quantity of unhelpful advice in this thread is simply mind boggling. Hey, let's all hate paypal because they "steal" people's money. Ignoring the seriously thorny legal bramble that the OP has run headlong into with nary a concern. There is a bounteous variety of comments of the form "Paypal sux! {Use X instead!}" Where X may be stripe, or wepay, or whatever. Ignoring the fact that stripe wouldn't help…
What, so PayPal allowed him to use their service with a Social Security number, then they take his money because he doesn't have one? PayPal is the one at fault here. Don't let someone use your service without adequate ID. Tell them and require it before you can use the service.
No. You don't need an SSN as long as it's less than $600 a year. This was correct.
His money hasn't been taken; they just won't disburse it until he does his free paperwork, as required by the US Government. That's entirely legitimate.
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> PayPal is the one at fault here. Don't let someone use your service without adequate ID.
They did not. When OP does the rest of what he's supposed to do, he's going to have his money unlocked.
PayPal is being as liberal, correctly, as the law permits.
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> Tell them and require it before you can use the service.
Yeah, they did. Maybe you should read the user agreement of a system before using it to collect nearly a quarter million dollars internationally. It's only three pages.
There is a point at which OP had a responsibility, too.
Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#265Earlier quoted context omitted.
What, so PayPal allowed him to use their service with a Social Security number, then they take his money because he doesn't have one? PayPal is the one at fault here. Don't let someone use your service without adequate ID. Tell them and require it before you can use the service.
You can deposit the funds without any tax details or linking any bank account. But you cannot withdraw it without one. If transferring money without SSN is illegal; I wonder how collecting it without one would be legal.
One place an American can usually quite easily check this is at your local gambling area. They are locked by the same rules. If you win big at the horse races, you don't get to take your money until you fill out tax paperwork.
This is no different, except that OP is international, and didn't know our rules as a result.
Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#266Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can deposit the funds without any tax details or linking any bank account. But you cannot withdraw it without one. If transferring money without SSN is illegal; I wonder how collecting it without one would be legal.
Then PayPal should make this very, very clear. In fact, I'd go further: they should mandate that you provide an SSN before you can collect money. It's unethical to do otherwise: anyone who uses PayPal to collect money will want to withdraw it.
Two, these rules do not come from PayPal; they come from the US Federal Government.
Three, the thing you're saying they should make clear is something someone else guessed about, and it's not correct. As long as the number is under $600 a year, there's no paperwork required.
I don't understand why we're all panicking so hard about a set of guesses that people have made. If you just think the situation over a little bit, it's pretty obvious that what's really going on is OP hasn't finished his free tax paperwork, and that PayPal can't hand out money until the tax situation is made legal.
And when you look at it that way, PayPal is actually doing exactly the right thing.
Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#267Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#268Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#269Re: I made $200K and PayPal locked my account
#270Earlier quoted context omitted.
But they don't have to police it. And they shouldn't.
Sorry, did you just suggest that a payment processor should not be required to ensure that when they hand money out, it's done legally?