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Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

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Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#41

Post by MartinCron »

recuter wrote: post #18
mtrimpe wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When talking with a friend of mine about me having dropped out of college because I was too bored, he once said: "If you were that smart you would've just finished it next to all your other stuff." I was pretty much this kid, or close to it, and to this day that statement is still one of the most valuable, harshest truths to me. So just challenge the kid to make it both work, run the company and finish high-school. I…

Maybe there's a point like this to be made about college but I don't understand how 3 more years of high school would benefit him - what's wrong with a GED? It just seems so much more time efficient.

For better or worse, a GED has a stigma as being an inferior option. Just something to be aware of.

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#42

Post by cafard »

I vote for GED and dropping out.

I did not go to a particularly good high school, but I didn't think that it was entirely a waste of time. However, I had no idea what I wanted to do after finishing my schooling. This kid does. As somebody said, the successful business will catch somebody's eye in some admissions office. Hell, Alexander Hamilton was a manager rather than an owner, and Columbia was happy to take him.

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#43

Post by amorphid »

I'm pretty sure the GED was invented for this kid. He's learning a bunch of stuff now I wish I'd learned at that age. I stayed in school because I didn't have a better idea, but I certainly would have chased a better opportunity. Telling him to stay in school is a natural thing to do, but it sounds like he's old enough to make big decisions for himself.

If the people around hin strong arm him, give him crap, or generally disapprove of his plan to drop out, it's not going to help him (in my opinion). Should I be fortunate enough to be in his position at 15, I'd hope that the people around me would care enough to educate me about my options. This could include staying in school, pursuing school in some other capacity (child actors do it), or simply walking away. There's always the opportunity to go back later, but there's very little chance he'll learn a more valuable lesson by walking away from something he productive that he cares about towards something in which his sees little value.

I propose this. His friends and family go to work for him. They agree to help him make the business more successful. In return, he agrees to pursue a certain level of education for at least two years. Just one crazy idea.

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#44

Post by shantanubala »

mattbee wrote: post #36

Wow. It's definitely a goofy, pompous, rambling letter written by someone who doesn't know what he doesn't know yet. But assuming the business is profitable, there's zero chance that you or his parents can stop him from pursuing it at this point. I think this 15-year old's decision is made, and the point to intervene might have been when he started employing people. I wasn't particularly academic, but wasn't driven /…

> It's definitely a goofy, pompous, rambling letter written by someone who doesn't know what he doesn't know yet.

Further, I find it a bit odd that the kid, knowing that his parents are paying thousands of dollars (I'm assuming) to attend a private school decides to start neglecting his classes. I'm likely just not doing a good job of understanding his point of view, but it feels selfish and immature.

Did he not want to discuss his ambitions with his parents? They clearly care about him (at least, remarkably more than many of the kids that went to my high school).

Is the company really consuming all of his time? Or is this letter satisfying a desire to rebel? These are important questions to ask him (but probably in a less confrontational tone).

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#45

Post by viraptor »

il wrote: post #14

He founded a startup with $350K in revenue and his parents will be disappointed? Really? This guy is not your typical at-risk high school dropout. He's clearly a true entrepreneur and a winner. At this point, he can pretty much write his own ticket in life. He doesn't need the arbitrary rules and stifling structure of high school to be successful. His parents grew up in a very different world, and they need to unders…

Agreed, but:

> Education and keeping your head down in a stable corporate job are not the ticket to prosperity anymore.

...are not the only ticket...

They still are and entrepreneurs are still a tiny minority. Almost everyone around you lives depending on a stable job with not that many options to go up. World is different from the HN echo chamber. Education and corporate jobs are still valid - in different ways, context and to a different degree than for the last generation - sure. But they're still valid.

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#46

Post by mindcrime »

Honestly, if he's accomplished what he claims to have, and he manages to get his GED (which will be enough to qualify him to continue his education later in college if he chooses), then I would't be that opposed to letting him go ahead and drop out.

I'd push for at least getting the GED though... that way, worst case, if his business ambitions don't pan out, he can always go back to college (starting at a community college if he has to, since they are often guaranteed admittance, if you have a HS diploma or GED).

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#47

Post by ams6110 »

mattbee wrote: post #36

Wow. It's definitely a goofy, pompous, rambling letter written by someone who doesn't know what he doesn't know yet. But assuming the business is profitable, there's zero chance that you or his parents can stop him from pursuing it at this point. I think this 15-year old's decision is made, and the point to intervene might have been when he started employing people. I wasn't particularly academic, but wasn't driven /…

Yes, he sounds like every 15 year old I know (including my own son) who is absolutely convinced that school is useless and a waste of time. That said, for most people the purpose of school is to prepare them to be able to support themselves and their families, and it sounds like he's basically able to do that now.

School is something you can always come back to, but once you start into the family/kids part of your life it becomes a lot more difficult for most people. The best time to be in school is when you don't have any responsibilities to support anyone else.

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#48

Post by danielweber »

il wrote: post #14

He founded a startup with $350K in revenue and his parents will be disappointed? Really? This guy is not your typical at-risk high school dropout. He's clearly a true entrepreneur and a winner. At this point, he can pretty much write his own ticket in life. He doesn't need the arbitrary rules and stifling structure of high school to be successful. His parents grew up in a very different world, and they need to unders…

What are profit margins like in the hosting business? In retail, $350,000 in revenue means about $3,500 in profit.

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#49

Post by mcintyre1994 »

If what he claims is true, that's hugely impressive, and in terms of how successful he will be, it doesn't matter if he stays in school or not. If he's done that by 15, he's probably not going to learn anything that will change his mind unless and until he goes to University.

School isn't going to help him make more of himself than he has, all it will effect is his current business. With respect to his parents and school, it would be unfair, in my opinion, to stop him doing what it takes to make that an even bigger success.

His letter is inaccurate in saying education gives you nothing, I'm 18 and would disagree profusely. I've studied Computer Science for a few months after being suckered into a short lived technology business, and it's changed a lot about how I think.

However, he does come across in some respects as a smart business guy - where he discusses Minecraft hosting as a fad and tells of his longer term ambitions for that company - that's a business guy whose already made up his mind.

Re: Ask HN: Friend's 15 year old wants to drop out, I've been asked to intervene

#50

Post by mindcrime »

MartinCron wrote: post #41
recuter wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe there's a point like this to be made about college but I don't understand how 3 more years of high school would benefit him - what's wrong with a GED? It just seems so much more time efficient.

For better or worse, a GED has a stigma as being an inferior option. Just something to be aware of.

Sure, right up until you finish a college degree or have enough work experience that nobody asks about your HS experience. If he just went to a community college and got an Associate Degree in something, the difference between having a "real" HS diploma and having a GED vanishes in the wash. Transfer from the CC to a regular university and he's on the exact same track as before, except for possibly not going to Princeton or Harvard, and instead being at $STATE_SCHOOL. Big deal.

Don't get me wrong.. for most kids, I'd suggest going ahead and sticking around HS and finishing. But it's not very long after high-school when your high-school "credentials" become totally insignificant.

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