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Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

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Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#31

Post by bmj »

rjurney wrote: post #22
dangoldin wrote: post #5

This doesn't really address how to solve the issue. Would going to farmer's markets/growing your own be the only way to address this on an individual scale? Or would the farmers be doing the same thing.

It depends. I think most organic growers use modern, disease tolerant breeds that produce as much as possible - just like commercial farmers, they just lack certain Monsanto genetic improvements. So you will see dilution of minerals in larger fruits in greater numbers per plant, if that is the primary cause of the decrease in minerals. On the other hand if the cause is primarily due to poor soil that relies entirely…

For me, it's far more important to buy locally than it is to buy organic (though it's also easy, at least where I am, to do both). The food industry has caught on to the organic trend and there are now organic factory farms which are only slightly better than non-organic factory farms. And organic guidelines don't prohibit the use of some pesticides. Granted, what they might use isn't as bad, but it is pesticide nonetheless.

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#32

Post by knome »

lutorm wrote: post #25

"The Omnivore's Dilemma" is a great book about this. One thing I learned there is that if you buy a strawberry flavored something that lists "natural flavorings" on it, that doesn't mean it has any strawberry in it. "Natural" just means the material originates in nature, not that the actual molecules are natural. Material from corn chemically processed into something that tastes (barely) remininscent of strawberry is…

Your mention of natural versus artificial flavours reminded me of this post :

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=369249

The article makes for a good read.

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#33

Post by bmj »

rjurney wrote: post #4

Its not surprising that 60 years after the green revolution ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Revolution ) that we would have washed trace minerals from the soil of our most productive farmland, which produces most of our vegetables, resulting in them having lower mineral content. Its also not surprising that nitrogen fed fruits and vegetables bred for size and weight would be larger and so contain diluted mineral…

You are correct--soil damage has much to do with this. Wendell Berry (among others) has written much about this. Large scale farming tends not to view the soil and its cycles as important to the process of growing food.

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#34

Post by vlad »

jrockway wrote: post #14
old-gregg wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* people are eating worse food, but they are choosing to do so, not being forced. * Really? Try finding a Coke with real sugar, and try getting a week worth of food without any corn syrup in them. My understanding is that the corn industry is basically forcing their products down our throats by lobbying the hell out of Washington.

Try finding a Coke with real sugar, and try getting a week worth of food without any corn syrup in them. This is easy enough. Red Bull makes a cola with real sugar (expensive, but pretty tasty). It's easy to avoid corn syrup when you don't buy processed foods. Go to your local organic market, and you'll find a whole store that contains no corn syrup what so ever. (A little bird told me that you can cook your own food…

Every story I read mentions that real sugar is cheaper to produce, but corn syrup comes from corn which is subsidized by taxpayers.

Secondly, it is likely that much of real food (as you call it) would be cheaper than it is now, if it were not considered a premium product.

Third, HFCS, more than corn, is the problem. It is put in many products, even hot dogs. Avoiding products with HFCS might be a good strategy to get in shape simply because a person may have to go out of their way to find healthy food they can afford. But a biological reason is that the human body is not designed for processing fructose.

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#35

Post by ars »

Semiapies wrote: post #21
jrockway wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try finding a Coke with real sugar, and try getting a week worth of food without any corn syrup in them. This is easy enough. Red Bull makes a cola with real sugar (expensive, but pretty tasty). It's easy to avoid corn syrup when you don't buy processed foods. Go to your local organic market, and you'll find a whole store that contains no corn syrup what so ever. (A little bird told me that you can cook your own food…

You can also find sugared Coke if you live near the Mexican or Canadian borders in the US. Or if you look for the bottles of Coke sold around Passover. [Correcting my earlier misnomer - Coke with corn syrup is perfectly "kosher", just not appropriate for Passover.] (I don't actually like either type. Weirdly, I only like the taste of Diet Coke, and not even Coke Zero.)

The holiday is Passover and it's in a month from now. You should be able find the sugar versions in about 2 weeks.

Also, I've heard that the coke bottler in western PA has switched to sugar coke year round.

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#36

Post by jacoblyles »

rjurney wrote: post #4

Its not surprising that 60 years after the green revolution ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Revolution ) that we would have washed trace minerals from the soil of our most productive farmland, which produces most of our vegetables, resulting in them having lower mineral content. Its also not surprising that nitrogen fed fruits and vegetables bred for size and weight would be larger and so contain diluted mineral…

Couldn't I just eat 30% more vegetables? Or vitamin fortified wheat products?

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#37

Post by menloparkbum »

Semiapies wrote: post #21
jrockway wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try finding a Coke with real sugar, and try getting a week worth of food without any corn syrup in them. This is easy enough. Red Bull makes a cola with real sugar (expensive, but pretty tasty). It's easy to avoid corn syrup when you don't buy processed foods. Go to your local organic market, and you'll find a whole store that contains no corn syrup what so ever. (A little bird told me that you can cook your own food…

You can also find sugared Coke if you live near the Mexican or Canadian borders in the US. Or if you look for the bottles of Coke sold around Passover. [Correcting my earlier misnomer - Coke with corn syrup is perfectly "kosher", just not appropriate for Passover.] (I don't actually like either type. Weirdly, I only like the taste of Diet Coke, and not even Coke Zero.)

You don't need to live by the border. Just go to a Mexican market and get the glass bottled Coke.

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#38

Post by ars »

bmj wrote: post #31
rjurney wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends. I think most organic growers use modern, disease tolerant breeds that produce as much as possible - just like commercial farmers, they just lack certain Monsanto genetic improvements. So you will see dilution of minerals in larger fruits in greater numbers per plant, if that is the primary cause of the decrease in minerals. On the other hand if the cause is primarily due to poor soil that relies entirely…

For me, it's far more important to buy locally than it is to buy organic (though it's also easy, at least where I am, to do both). The food industry has caught on to the organic trend and there are now organic factory farms which are only slightly better than non-organic factory farms. And organic guidelines don't prohibit the use of some pesticides. Granted, what they might use isn't as bad, but it is pesticide none…

>For me, it's far more important to buy locally

Why? Certain plants grow better in different places. It makes no sense to grow a plant locally if it would grow better elsewhere. It usually costs extra energy to do so as well.

If you are not sure which one is better for the environment check the price - the cheaper one is better (pesticides not included).

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#39

Post by Semiapies »

menloparkbum wrote: post #37
Semiapies wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can also find sugared Coke if you live near the Mexican or Canadian borders in the US. Or if you look for the bottles of Coke sold around Passover. [Correcting my earlier misnomer - Coke with corn syrup is perfectly "kosher", just not appropriate for Passover.] (I don't actually like either type. Weirdly, I only like the taste of Diet Coke, and not even Coke Zero.)

You don't need to live by the border. Just go to a Mexican market and get the glass bottled Coke.

I'm a few hundred miles away myself, but in a border state. How far into the US interior do they ship it?

Re: Supermarket vegetables now 5-40% lower in nutrients than 50 years ago

#40

Post by vlad »

Semiapies wrote: post #20
jules wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which products contain corn syrup? I didn't know that it existed until now, but I can't think of anything I eat that could contain corn syrup.

Well, there are two types of corn syrup - plain old "corn syrup" ala Karo, and high fructose corn syrup, which is a very common sweetener in processed foods. (HFCS is also, for some reason, a bit of a nutritional boogeyman for a lot of people. There's no actual evidence that consuming X calories of it is any worse for people than consuming X calories of sugar or honey, but it's the new "dioxin" in some circles.)

If not, then why do nutritionists, athletes, diabetics, and bodybuilders favor sugar instead of HFCS?
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