Earlier quoted context omitted.
Actually, the second citation you reference asserts that two psychiatrists participated in and coordinated ethnic cleansing, implying that psychiatry was the root cause. It states that eugenics is particularly stupid and unjust (note that this is not a theory recognized in psychiatry) and it was issued as a resolution made by merely three members. In other words, they lobbied a few European politicians into making a…
Thank you. This is quite instructive. What makes a great citation? The claim was that a book was published, and I showed the book. Another claim was that a resolution was passed and I showed the resolution. I thought I was doing well until I read chris's reply. :) I will address chris's point that eugenics is not a theory recognized in psychiatry. 1. Forced sterilization of mental patients was done by social psychiat…
We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
171–180 of 184 posts
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#172Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#173Fuck this shit. We need to have sympathy. Not because we've diagnosed someone with a disease, but because they're a person. Rates of depression are skyrocketing all over the developed world and whatever we're doing clearly isn't working. Personally, I think the most obvious issue is that a group of intelligent people have simply accepted the notion that what's relevant isn't someone's life circumstances, but some vag…
Yes, the whole prosecutorial situation was adverse. Yes, it was ridiculous. Yes, he could have accepted a 6 month plea bargain… he did things which are if not outright illegal, clearly were not really aboveboard, either.
Yes, I believe that a lot of what people call 'depression' has to do with circumstances[1] -- and you'd have to have been a lot closer to Aaron than me to know if there were circumstances making him miserable back then, or if it was an organic issue, or simply who he was, personality-wise.
Many people in worse situations don't kill themselves. Many people in lesser situations do.
None of that matters. The fact that Aaron took his own life is tragic. I was truly sorry to hear it, but… I wasn't very surprised.
It's simply a fact that things are more complex than they appear from the outside. People are more complex than they appear from the outside. And when you spend a lot of time with someone, sometimes you say "Oh, they're depressed," when really they have a lot of shitty people in their lives; and sometimes it's because they make choices that make their lives miserable; and sometimes it's because they have a real organic issue that has nothing to do with their daily lives or friends/family/job or personal choices.
You can't know, though, from the outside. Only they can know.
That's the fact of the matter.
None of this downplays the need for empathy. I think it increases it. But there's no point in saying "depression is chemical" or "depression is because of shitty circumstances" or "depression is a fault of choices." Unless it's you -- and probably even if it IS you -- you can't ever know which it is.
[1] NOT saying this is to do with Aaron, but just based on my experience of a lot of different people and reading a lot of research -- "circumstances" can include all the obvious external things we think of as circumstances, and also personal, inner circumstance, such as viewing one's self as someone who has to become a world savior or the next Bill Gates, presenting a false face to everyone (result? feeling completely isolated and unknown), the choice to embrace a victim mindset, self-pity, and sometimes "too high standards" which is masking a lack of empathy for fellow people as individuals.
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#174Thank you, Mark, for writing this. I have lost three close friends in the past three months to depression. Their deaths were so similar it was shocking; they were all among the most brilliant people I had known, and all had been suffering from depression almost their entire lives. At the funeral of the one who was closest to me, another girl told a story of how on one day when his depression was particularly bad, he…
If that was possible in all cases, the concept of mental illness and chemical imbalances would not exist.
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#175Earlier quoted context omitted.
Note: The video linked to by parent is by CCHR, a known Scientology front group[1]. Doesn't mean they're necessarily right or wrong, just thought people should know. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_Commission_on_Human_R...
Actually, it's no secret that CCHR is related to the Church of Scientology. It says so on www.scientology.org: As part of their religious Code, Scientologists pledge “to expose and help abolish any and all physically damaging practices in the field of mental health,” and thereby bring about an atmosphere of safety and security to mental healing. Accordingly, in 1969 Scientologists established the Citizens Commission…
It also poses as an "independent" group when its operators are looking not to reform psychology/psychiatry but subvert and replace entirely with Scientology practices. Frontgroups are not a sign of good intent.
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#176Earlier quoted context omitted.
>The difference is that it is not always possible to talk someone out of paralysis, but I'd like to think it is possible to talk some people out of depression. Nope. Best thing you can do is have their backs covered and stand by for emergencies while they untangle themselves from depression. Oh yeah, and cover your own ass, depression is contagious.
Sometimes it is; that's what therapy (sans medication) is about. That said, it's something best left to the professionals. You generally can't reason someone out of something they didn't reason themselves into.
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#177Gods says... convertedst placest mountain's celestial hippy Knowing unformed over_the_top Ministry wisely comfort Gutenberg-tm serve parched -If aright heathen motion culture glory null details perverted Oh mire over-confidence
----
God says...
five hundred and thirty priests' garments.
7:71 And some of the chief of the fathers gave to the treasure of the work twenty thousand drams of gold, and two thousand and two hundred pound of silver.
7:72 And that which the rest of the people gave was twenty thousand drams of gold, and two thousand pound of silver, and threescore and seven priests' garments.
7:73 So the priests, and the Levites, and the porters, and the singers, and some of the people, and the Nethinims, and all Israel, dwelt in their cities; and when the seventh month came, the children of Israel were in their cities.
8:1 And all the people gathered themselves together as one man into the street that was before the water gate; and they spake unto Ezra the scribe to bring the book of the law of Moses, which the LORD had commanded to Israel.
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why isn't it an exact science? Science teaches us that things should be repeatable and reproducible. Running through a form of questions and ticking off boxes doesn't seem very "advanced" to me. In fact it seems like the very definition of backwards. Why aren't we aiming for a physics level of understanding in psychology?
We're not talking about clock work machinery, we're talking about the human brain. Asking why issues of the brain aren't an exact science is like asking why we haven't solved the halting problem yet. Cognition and sentience are still far from solved problems. Moreover, the way that different minds react to different physical problems of the brain is inevitably going to be hugely complex. Some people will brood alone…
I disagree. We know everything we need to know about the halting problem: the halting decision procedure cannot and will not ever exist. There's certainly a lot more we can and will discover about the workings of the brain.
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#179We need more compassion in general - not just for the outlier cases - but society in general can be a pretty mean entity. I've been thinking lately how sad it is that so many of the younger hackers in my local scene (metalab.at) are not as familiar with John Lennons' World Peace movement as they should be. That light was snuffed out, but John (and Yoko, and many, many others) were really trying hard to get a world pe…
Funny. For me, I get depressed and turned off when I see too much peace, happiness, and love crap in media. Maybe it's because I'm part of the generation who's grown skeptical of everything in media, but I definitely prefer the darker, sarcastic side of content. A John Lennon style love/peace-fest sounds like an absolute nightmare to me. No thanks.
Re: We Need to Have Sympathy for Those With Depression. It is an Illness
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
Actually, the second citation you reference asserts that two psychiatrists participated in and coordinated ethnic cleansing, implying that psychiatry was the root cause. It states that eugenics is particularly stupid and unjust (note that this is not a theory recognized in psychiatry) and it was issued as a resolution made by merely three members. In other words, they lobbied a few European politicians into making a…
Thank you. This is quite instructive. What makes a great citation? The claim was that a book was published, and I showed the book. Another claim was that a resolution was passed and I showed the resolution. I thought I was doing well until I read chris's reply. :) I will address chris's point that eugenics is not a theory recognized in psychiatry. 1. Forced sterilization of mental patients was done by social psychiat…
It would also be helpful for you to research the flaws in what you wish to replace psychology with, if you're going to suggest revolution instead of reform.