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For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

blogs.smithsonianmag.com

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Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#111

> Old Karp was usually delighted by the latest innovations that the scientists brought up from their camp, and though he steadfastly refused to believe that man had set foot on the moon, he adapted swiftly to the idea of satellites. The Lykovs had noticed them as early as the 1950s, when "the stars began to go quickly across the sky," and Karp himself conceived a theory to explain this: "People have thought something…

[deleted]

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#113

There were 4 children, and one died. I have often wondered why the world's homo sapien population did not grow faster during the period 200,000 BC to 10,000 BC. In his book Extinct Humans, Ian Tattersall has argued that fully modern homo sapiens took shape around 200,000 BC and left Africa around 150,000 BC. http://www.amazon.com/Extinct-Humans-Ian-Tattersall/dp/08133... The growth of the population was very slow. So…

The article doesn't mention the age of the mother when the family went into isolation in 1936, but judging from the age of the father and the age of the oldest child, she would have been somewhere between her mid/late 20s and late 30s. That could be one reason why she only had two kids in isolation. Also, the family experienced famine, which affects fertility negatively. And the family lived in one room. The lack of privacy may not have been conducive to reproduction.

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ouch. Trying to recruit church followers? A bit cavalier with that description I feel. "With a great big bow to request of all: I need a man as an assistant, one whom I will not survive, [who] lives so not good, with weeks of being alone. Do not leave me for Christ's sake. Have mercy upon a wretched orphan, who is in trouble [and] suffering."

Both you and greghinch seem to have a very negative association with that word. Maybe having grown up in the church, I don't see that word from the same angle as the two of you.

'Recruit' implies asking people to adopt her religion, as opposed to asking existing believers for assistance.

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#115
post #113

There were 4 children, and one died. I have often wondered why the world's homo sapien population did not grow faster during the period 200,000 BC to 10,000 BC. In his book Extinct Humans, Ian Tattersall has argued that fully modern homo sapiens took shape around 200,000 BC and left Africa around 150,000 BC. http://www.amazon.com/Extinct-Humans-Ian-Tattersall/dp/08133... The growth of the population was very slow. So…

The article doesn't mention the age of the mother when the family went into isolation in 1936, but judging from the age of the father and the age of the oldest child, she would have been somewhere between her mid/late 20s and late 30s. That could be one reason why she only had two kids in isolation. Also, the family experienced famine, which affects fertility negatively. And the family lived in one room. The lack of…

Which may have also been true during the era 200,000 to 10,000 BC: famine, war, political disturbances, persecution, poor nutrition.

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#116
post #99

There were 4 children, and one died. I have often wondered why the world's homo sapien population did not grow faster during the period 200,000 BC to 10,000 BC. In his book Extinct Humans, Ian Tattersall has argued that fully modern homo sapiens took shape around 200,000 BC and left Africa around 150,000 BC. http://www.amazon.com/Extinct-Humans-Ian-Tattersall/dp/08133... The growth of the population was very slow. So…

They were also at times barely surviving. They might not have had much interest in sex. Even if they did, the mother's reproductive processes may have been reduced due to lack energy/nutrition. You also don't know how many stillbirths they had. It's probably not something they would readily talk about, (and not something that the geologists were eager to discuss).

Which may have also been true during the era 200,000 to 10,000 BC: famine, war, political disturbances, persecution, poor nutrition.

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#117
post #100

There were 4 children, and one died. I have often wondered why the world's homo sapien population did not grow faster during the period 200,000 BC to 10,000 BC. In his book Extinct Humans, Ian Tattersall has argued that fully modern homo sapiens took shape around 200,000 BC and left Africa around 150,000 BC. http://www.amazon.com/Extinct-Humans-Ian-Tattersall/dp/08133... The growth of the population was very slow. So…

Poor nutrition reduces fertility.

Which may have also been true during the era 200,000 to 10,000 BC: famine, war, political disturbances, persecution, poor nutrition.

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#118

How did they tell their kids about the birds and the bees? Must have been very awkward as a teenager.

How so? Humans survived for quite some time indeed without the concept of hiding sexuality from children. I would imagine in prehistory, the birds and the bees was explained through visual observation of your elders or just by figuring it out when the urge arose. Sex doesn't really need to be explained or defined unless you have a need to put it into context of cultural acceptance (which doesn't matter in this case).…

> How so?

Because of the incest taboo.

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#119
post #31

The daughters spoke a language distorted by a lifetime of isolation. "When the sisters talked to each other, it sounded like a slow, blurred cooing." It's interesting how isolation does to a spoken language in only one generation. I'm guessing they had nobody but themselves to talk to, so any mispronunciation would be greatly exaggerated.

My husband & I lived in Vienna and we were the only people who spoke out loud to each other on a daily basis (especially in English), and we understand each other very very well in any case, and we got the point where we often didn't even speak in complete sentences over a mere matter of months. When we traveled abroad for a month in an English-speaking country, it took me several days to feel like I was making sense…

Were you in a few monastery?

Re: For 40 Years, This Russian Family Was Cut Off From All Human Contact

#120

There were 4 children, and one died. I have often wondered why the world's homo sapien population did not grow faster during the period 200,000 BC to 10,000 BC. In his book Extinct Humans, Ian Tattersall has argued that fully modern homo sapiens took shape around 200,000 BC and left Africa around 150,000 BC. http://www.amazon.com/Extinct-Humans-Ian-Tattersall/dp/08133... The growth of the population was very slow. So…

Long gestation, long time to sexual maturity, prevalence of single births (twins occur naturally in about 1 of 60 births, triplets 1:8100), very high infant mortality (up to 50% or more, much of the increase in human lifespan is actually a decrease in mortality from 0-10 years). Childbirth was highly risky, and many women had large numbers of pregnancies (10 or more weren't uncommon), with a high risk of death in any. Few women lived to old age (an inversion of today's lifespan trends).

Add in subsistence existence with poor food storage and little means to store surplus, and life was tenuous. Civilization and the formation of cities helped get around the food store problem, but introduced disease, particularly with poor management of human wastes and garbage.

Improving available food, energy, sanitation, acute medical care, obstetrics, decreased criminal and military violence, all contributed to an explosion of population beginning in the 19th century, and rapidly accelerating through the 20th.

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