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VMware to cut 900 jobs

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Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#31

Post by pekk »

robomartin wrote: post #29
VeejayRampay wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah that's why that whole "job creators" / "we built this" routine doesn't really register with me. Let's call it what it really is, an extremely well-designed (I have to recognize) machine to generate as much money while employing as few people as possible to maximize profit. Now what they're doing with all that cash, I'm still wondering to this day. If someone has a sensible answer to that question I'd be really i…

> Yeah that's why that whole "job creators" / "we built this" routine doesn't really register with me. That's 'cause you probably never built a business from scratch. Believe me, not one person who has labored to start, launch and run their own business would make the comment you have. Not ONE. These kinds of statements only come out of a certain place and this is the same place that confused revenue with profit. Thi…

If you are working to build a company in the US, you are building on top of MANY layers of the US infrastructure. Security, transportation, lights, banks, credit are all things in which the American public is invested, in the public interest. And any company of size depends on individuals besides the founder to do its work. It is not accurate to pretend that you are 100%, solely responsible for your own success, without any other contributing factors. And it is not right to decline any social responsibility in the society which has enabled your successes.

Doesn't mean you were guaranteed success. Doesn't mean you didn't have to pay bills or take risks. Doesn't mean you did nothing. Does mean you are not a heroic John Galt pulling himself up by the bootstraps in spite of the rest of society being parasitic.

It was your choice to start a business, don't complain at other people if they have not taken the same risk. They also don't have the business.

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#32

Post by VeejayRampay »

tedunangst wrote: post #26
VeejayRampay wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah that's why that whole "job creators" / "we built this" routine doesn't really register with me. Let's call it what it really is, an extremely well-designed (I have to recognize) machine to generate as much money while employing as few people as possible to maximize profit. Now what they're doing with all that cash, I'm still wondering to this day. If someone has a sensible answer to that question I'd be really i…

Easy answer is easy. Revenue is not the same as profit.

Point taken, profit is not revenue, you're absolutely right.

Yet I looked the profit for VMWare for Q3 of 2012 and it's indicated that they made some 150 million dollars in Q3 of 2012. Then again, I am not an entrepreneur, sure, I might not understand all the details so this might be a bit naive but 150 million dollars in profit still seems like a good chunk of money and kind of clashes in my head with firing 900 people, the kind of situation I would expect if the company was bleeding money all over the place.

Then I looked some more and found this and it got even more confusing: http://www.eweek.com/virtualization/vmware-q4-earnings-up-bu...

From a noob outsider's point of view, it's almost as if the "value" of the company is not really correlated with its ability to make money and release good products, but on some decision from the market. And I guess this is where I (and most people who are not stock jockeys) completely lose track, where does that projection of what the earnings should be come from? How do people gauge that a quarter is a solid one or a bad one? Real question, any insight appreciated.

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#33

Post by homosaur »

kjackson2012 wrote: post #13

I shorted VMW just before the close today via puts. It was only 2 contracts and the strike price was at $90. I was going to bet more, I usually go in a position with 10 contracts, but I have some financial obligations coming up so I didn't want to risk too much. I have a few friends that work there. They are happy, but they say that the company lacks any sense of urgency. After Maritz left and more recently Steve Her…

I deal with them as a customer and I will tell you that everything you say is exactly the way their customers see it. We're begging to find a reason to move the rest of our stuff off VMWare. Their technology is dull and pedestrian compared to what some vendors are bringing in. They are very good at what they do but every time I talk to a person in the company it just feels like they are in maintenance mode and are bored with their own products.

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#34

Post by VeejayRampay »

robomartin wrote: post #29
VeejayRampay wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah that's why that whole "job creators" / "we built this" routine doesn't really register with me. Let's call it what it really is, an extremely well-designed (I have to recognize) machine to generate as much money while employing as few people as possible to maximize profit. Now what they're doing with all that cash, I'm still wondering to this day. If someone has a sensible answer to that question I'd be really i…

> Yeah that's why that whole "job creators" / "we built this" routine doesn't really register with me. That's 'cause you probably never built a business from scratch. Believe me, not one person who has labored to start, launch and run their own business would make the comment you have. Not ONE. These kinds of statements only come out of a certain place and this is the same place that confused revenue with profit. Thi…

Sorry for confusing profit and revenue, it was a mistake. Being French, I was not brought up in a world of Bloomberg and stock markets, so I've obviously been short-changed on the whole business-venture / capitalism theory. My bad.

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#35

Post by tedunangst »

VeejayRampay wrote: post #32
tedunangst wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Easy answer is easy. Revenue is not the same as profit.

Point taken, profit is not revenue, you're absolutely right. Yet I looked the profit for VMWare for Q3 of 2012 and it's indicated that they made some 150 million dollars in Q3 of 2012. Then again, I am not an entrepreneur, sure, I might not understand all the details so this might be a bit naive but 150 million dollars in profit still seems like a good chunk of money and kind of clashes in my head with firing 900 peo…

Consider that the fully loaded cost of an employee (salary, insurance, stock, taxes, etc.) may be somewhere around $150k. 900 people like that cost 135 million. So basically, most of that 150 million they made is because they didn't have 900 extra people on payroll.

"The company projected annual 2013 total revenues to be in the range of $5.23 billion to $5.35 billion." That's a variation of 120 million right there. Those 900 people could mean the difference between making money with the high estimate vs the low estimate.

Note that the stock price dropped not because it was a bad quarter (it was a good quarter), but because vmware said projected future revenue is expected to be lower than predicted.

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#36

Post by 3pt14159 »

pekk wrote: post #31
robomartin wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yeah that's why that whole "job creators" / "we built this" routine doesn't really register with me. That's 'cause you probably never built a business from scratch. Believe me, not one person who has labored to start, launch and run their own business would make the comment you have. Not ONE. These kinds of statements only come out of a certain place and this is the same place that confused revenue with profit. Thi…

If you are working to build a company in the US, you are building on top of MANY layers of the US infrastructure. Security, transportation, lights, banks, credit are all things in which the American public is invested, in the public interest. And any company of size depends on individuals besides the founder to do its work. It is not accurate to pretend that you are 100%, solely responsible for your own success, with…

Just because I was born in a public hospital doesn't mean perpetual claim on life. The government may force lower-than-market acquisitions for land in order to provide more prevalent transportation infrastructure, but that doesn't make it right. Other, freer options could have existed, but violence of the state impede their spread.

I never signed the social contract; and food to slave does not entitle ownership. My use of the roads, or benefit derived from them, is defensible.

Else I ask; in what manner may I make myself free? Is there a way out of the perpetual claim against my livelihood?

Further, if social responsibility is so great for my common man, what right do you have to demand my efforts go towards local healthcare when others a bit further away starve? What makes a fellow countryman more due for grain than a differing skinned man in a land far away? Is it not indefensible to claim ownership of my resources for your health, but hold firm against the claims by others against claims of ownership against your wealth for nourishment.

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#37

Post by lquist »

Technical recruiter here. Just talked to VMWare recruiters that were interested in hiring as of last week. Doesn't mean that the story isn't true; just thought that I'd share.

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#38

Post by waps »

homosaur wrote: post #33
kjackson2012 wrote: post #13

I shorted VMW just before the close today via puts. It was only 2 contracts and the strike price was at $90. I was going to bet more, I usually go in a position with 10 contracts, but I have some financial obligations coming up so I didn't want to risk too much. I have a few friends that work there. They are happy, but they say that the company lacks any sense of urgency. After Maritz left and more recently Steve Her…

I deal with them as a customer and I will tell you that everything you say is exactly the way their customers see it. We're begging to find a reason to move the rest of our stuff off VMWare. Their technology is dull and pedestrian compared to what some vendors are bringing in. They are very good at what they do but every time I talk to a person in the company it just feels like they are in maintenance mode and are bo…

What are the things you're migrating to ? I'm voting for VirtualBox, but I guess you could go with kvm which has slightly better performance in my experience.

Care to share where you're moving to ?

Re: VMware to cut 900 jobs

#40

Post by chetanahuja »

joshAg wrote: post #14
dobbsbob wrote: post #2

this is why I don't work for mega software corps i bet all these poor bastard devs had to do 'team building exercises', file endless TPS reports, and forced to enjoy TGIF jeans day to indoctrinate you into the company cult then it's layoff time.

i work for riverbed. before their opnet acquisition in december they had about 1600 employees. now they have more, but i don't know if the new size is supposed to be public or not. my team building exercise was last week and it was 3.5 hours of go-karting in burlingame and a catered lunch. we had the rest of the day off. it was the first team building exercise my team did in my 12 months here, unless you count things…

Heh... it's funny/nice to see someone mentioning riverbed as an example of a "big company". I laugh because I was there when 150 counted as a huge headcount and the SF office had to move to fremont street (and before there was a south bay office). I left when it rapidly grew to about 600 or so soon after the IPO.
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