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How Doctors Die (2011)

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Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#91

Post by SoftwareMaven »

javert wrote: post #75
_delirium wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, well that's where we disagree. I can't control what genes I'm born with, and I don't think there's anything wrong with socializing those risks across the population. Let's say there's a 1% risk of me being born with some condition. I think it's perfectly fair for me to pay 1% of the cost of treating that condition, whether I'm born with it or not. I don't see why I should pay 100% the cost if I get unlucky in the…

I can't control what genes I'm born with, and I don't think there's anything wrong with socializing those risks across the population. What's wrong with it is that you're initiating force against me, and making my life manifestly worse. I mean, as someone who can pay for my own healthcare, this is what I get out of socialized medicine in the US: (1) Less money to spend on my own healthcare issues (2) Regulations that…

as someone who can pay for my own healthcare

Then just do it. It is unfortunate that Obamacare is forcing you to get insurance, but I'm sure you can find a medical plan with a ridiculously high deductible (specifically for people who are wealthy[1]) that will cost you next to nothing[2] and, similar to life insurance, protect you and your assets if something catastrophic happens.

1. I'm making no judgement about whether you are wealthy or just choose to pursue no healthcare.

2. Assuming they are still available next year. http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/07/13/obamacare-could-kill-...

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#92

Post by purplelobster »

quasque wrote: post #84
javert wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Done at the point of a gun" means that you're being forced to do it. If you say "no," they take what they want anyway, and lock you up.

Doing what? Being forced to pay taxes? That happens in every country and is surely a more general complaint, if it is indeed one at all.

Don't bother, libertarianism is like a religion to these people.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#93

Post by purplelobster »

philwelch wrote: post #61
purplelobster wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, obviously there are exceptions, but I wouldn't measure or defend a system based on the best case, but the average and standard deviation. Unfortunately, a huge amount of people are falling through the cracks. Sweden's system might be worse for rich/upper middle class people, but the average case is more than acceptable and the deviation is small. For instance, if you come in with a non life threatening conditio…

Historically, rich people from countries with socialized medicine would fly to the United States for medical treatment. We could stand to improve the quality of care for the poor in the US, but there's lots of room to do that in the existing system. For people who have health insurance benefits from their work, I think having a little bit more paperwork is better than waiting for months for surgery.

Again, it's completely irrelevant what amazing treatment rich people get. And please, find me any evidence that American health care is in any way better or that anyone is flying there to get treatment. I can only find evidence of the contrary. If I ever get seriously sick, I'll be on the first plane out of here.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#94

Post by patrickgzill »

martinced wrote: post #53
patrickgzill wrote: post #23

I don't see any statistics, just a very well-written article with some anecdotes.

Not everything needs statistics to ring a bell. I've seen two grandfathers of mine on which absurd medical care was given: one was seriously ill and maintained as a living mummy for months (he did look as bad as people who were rescued from extermination camp at the end of WWII) and another who, while in coma, had a leg cut off although everyone knew he wouldn't wake up. Who the heck wants to wake up with only one le…

No, I DO in fact, want the statistics, if a writer is going to make the claim that:

"And they don’t die like the rest of us. What’s unusual about them is not how much treatment they get compared to most Americans, but how little."

It should be easy to prove/disprove this, as doctors get surveyed all the time on different subjects.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#95

Post by nkurz »

pitiburi wrote: post #17
ben1040 wrote: post #2

HN Commentary from 2011: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3313570

The OP posted on that thread, so he knew this was a repost. Interesting article, but i fear for HN if reposting an old and interesting link you remember becomes a way of getting easy karma.

Oddly, I didn't know this was a repost. I came across the article again, I knew I'd read it before, but hadn't recalled that it had been on HN. It was posted long enough ago that the duplicate-catcher didn't alert me.

While the karma was a pleasant addition to an otherwise rough day, my intent was simply to pass on a thoughtful article to people I hoped would enjoy it. Perhaps an exponential decay on reposts would prevent abuse?

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#96

Post by [deleted] »

purplelobster wrote: post #93
philwelch wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historically, rich people from countries with socialized medicine would fly to the United States for medical treatment. We could stand to improve the quality of care for the poor in the US, but there's lots of room to do that in the existing system. For people who have health insurance benefits from their work, I think having a little bit more paperwork is better than waiting for months for surgery.

Again, it's completely irrelevant what amazing treatment rich people get. And please, find me any evidence that American health care is in any way better or that anyone is flying there to get treatment. I can only find evidence of the contrary. If I ever get seriously sick, I'll be on the first plane out of here.

[deleted]

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#97

Post by philwelch »

purplelobster wrote: post #93
philwelch wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historically, rich people from countries with socialized medicine would fly to the United States for medical treatment. We could stand to improve the quality of care for the poor in the US, but there's lots of room to do that in the existing system. For people who have health insurance benefits from their work, I think having a little bit more paperwork is better than waiting for months for surgery.

Again, it's completely irrelevant what amazing treatment rich people get. And please, find me any evidence that American health care is in any way better or that anyone is flying there to get treatment. I can only find evidence of the contrary. If I ever get seriously sick, I'll be on the first plane out of here.

Look, your hobbyhorse is obviously this notion that there are absolutely no redeeming characteristics to the US health care system, so there's obviously no point getting into a nuanced conversation with you. It's rather off topic anyway. I regret ever thinking you were capable of a reasonable conversation.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#99

Post by davidtanner »

geden wrote: post #67
davidtanner wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well buddy you'd be singing a different tune if the doctors discovered a medical issue and prevented you from dying. If you were so lightheaded and confused that you were unable to be your own advocate and get yourself some fluids and food then you probably should have gone to the hospital. If you just let doctors talk you into it and you didn't think it was warranted then you have a problem with your assertion skill…

You're ignoring the very lucid point he's making. Why is that? As a UK citizen I've never had to endure such nonsense around health. I don't know what's weirder, that such a crazy system was allowed to evolve or that people defend it.

I've had plenty of first and second hand experience with the american health care system and I am very aware that it's nowhere near ideal. This applies perhaps even more so in the area of mental health.

Still, I think the post I replied to above warrants criticism. Reading between the lines one might come to the conclusion that he went to the ER because he was out of shape.

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