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What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

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Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#281
post #200

Heather, I agree that people are unnecessarily rude to you. Don't sob. Your code shows you are already a more capable programmer than most of the ones I interview. No one has given you a clear answer as to why your code is reinventing the wheel, so allow me to do it politely. I took every single example from your README, and show you below how everything can be reimplemented with sed -r (nice extended regex syntax, m…

I've been coding since 1993 and I have never made room in my brain for stuff like -print0. Moreover, there are times when you'll want to do this stuff from within another program. What are you going to do, shell out to a find(1) pipeline? Then people like me will be giving you shit. There's nothing wrong with rewriting sed in Javascript.

" I've been coding since 1993 and I have never made room in my brain for stuff like -print0."

Seriously? find/xargs is nearly impossible to use (safely) without it.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#282
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, I blame it on the assumption that Aspergers must run rampant and is severely underdiagnosed in the dev community.

Think about this: this statement, right here, is a completely unfounded (i.e. you have no evidence about any of the 3 people being ASD, and the probability of all of them being ASD is really low even among geeks like us), passive-aggressive (you are attacking people with ASD but making it appear sympathetic), pseudo-intellectual (how much do you really know that you didn't read in superficial internet threads) insult…

I've worked with people with Asperger's and Autism in a clinical setting. I'm not talking out of my ass.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#283
post #200

Heather, I agree that people are unnecessarily rude to you. Don't sob. Your code shows you are already a more capable programmer than most of the ones I interview. No one has given you a clear answer as to why your code is reinventing the wheel, so allow me to do it politely. I took every single example from your README, and show you below how everything can be reimplemented with sed -r (nice extended regex syntax, m…

>If you care about simplicity, I would personally rather write a small shell script wrapping find/xargs/sed and hiding their arcane options, as opposed to writing 173 lines of js. I would rather use my language of choice to implement the above (mine wouldn't be JavaScript, but it clearly was Heather's) than to research all of those arcane command lines. Rather obviously YOUR language of choice for this kind of proble…

I believe that your complexity estimate in writing the wrapper indicates you are perhaps not a proficient shell scripter. However I sincerely believe it is possible to write such a wrapper in less than 15-20 lines. The trick is to do as little argument parsing as possible but enough to be safe (for example pass the ! -name "*.min.js" as is to find).

PS: I will do it in 15-20 lines, if only to prove a point, if someone sends 1 BTC to 1F43fceWvwznv4rH7s1B3du2w5VznFJY58 :) (yes, my time is valuable - I have other things to do)

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#284
post #200

Heather, I agree that people are unnecessarily rude to you. Don't sob. Your code shows you are already a more capable programmer than most of the ones I interview. No one has given you a clear answer as to why your code is reinventing the wheel, so allow me to do it politely. I took every single example from your README, and show you below how everything can be reimplemented with sed -r (nice extended regex syntax, m…

You have a valid point but its incomplete, allow me to explain you why we need projects like replace.

You are right in telling that sewing a few utilities using pipes can emulate 'replace'. But remember you are talking about learning those 'few' utilities first. Trust me unless you have practiced your way out of these thing with hundreds of hours with experience over years its humanly impossible to remember and use a tool like sed to its full capacity. The more utilities you add to your pipe chain the number of ways in which these utilities can be used more or less follows a exponential curve.

Now if some one comes along and gives you a version 1 of a tool that can simplify these things and give you simple way of doing things in a command instead of doing it with a ten pipe chain commands, he/she is ideally solving a problem of a great importance.

As some one who loves the Unix CLI, I have often wondered why people spend a whole day writing a java program what could have easily done with sed and awk in a line or two. But these days I understand why. Learning and using sed/awk to their full potential is a time consuming task. You not only have to learn them factually through a manual. You also need to study the problem cases for which they are appropriate. Then you need to go and put their solution patterns in your brain. Then you need to map all problem patterns with solution patterns. Then you need to learn all the arcane special cases. Generally this comes to a person over years practicing those utilities.

As a matter of fact Perl was invented because using C, with all these utilities was getting very difficult.

Now if somebody can give things like these. Which do many things out of the box, without you having to go through the pain of learning things and practicing over the years. They would have indeed given you a tool of great value.

In my experience even if some one fails working on something like this, by third or fourth version of the tool they generally come up with a thing of great value.

Think of this like Vim Vs Sublime Text 2. In case of vim there are ways of solving problems. In ST2 many of those solutions are automated and sometimes given to you out of the box.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#285
post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unfortunately the recent asberger pride movement doesn't help. The word is "Asperger's". 'Asperger pride' is an attempt to reduce the hateful ignorant bigotry that the neuro-atypical face every day. The kind of ignorance that leads to early death, reduced job opportunities, reduced educational opportunities etc.

Thanks for the correction, I got lazy there. I think the problem with 'Asperger pride' is it tends to focus on how neuro-typical people have wronged people on the spectrum. A lot of times the painful truth is that person with aspergers is at least partially culpable for the negative outcome of their social interactions. This becomes a major problem when you work in a place where almost everyone is on the autistic spe…

I don't know your workmates, but if I had to hazard a guess I would suggest that this is probably more a function of being in a highly male dominated environment rather than your co-workers actually having autistic traits.

If somebody is being a dick because they are hunting for a specific reaction from the other person that is not really Asperger behaviour.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#286

This is par for the course in the Rails community. Once some Rails devs get more experienced, they think it's ok to shit on everyone else. Granted, not all are like that...but many are. God forbid you should stumble into #RubyOnRails on IRC. Thank God for Stack Overflow!

This to me is very unfortunate. I'm an experienced Ruby and RubyOnRails developer, and I think that this is totally unacceptable. This is why the Python community flourishes (and I learned to code with Python!), and the Ruby community, which has unfortunately become equated to the Rails community, relatively languishes. I also think it's pretty funny/awful/ridiculous to see Rails devs hating on JS code. (JS is diffic…

Responses to Heather's post from a relatively well-known Python developer:

https://twitter.com/zeeg/status/294305445521268736

https://twitter.com/zeeg/status/294306974248607745

https://twitter.com/zeeg/status/294307486331187201

I guess it's just not all that black and white, is it?

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#287
post #72
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$ find ./ -type f -exec sed -i 's/ugly/beautiful/g' {} \; vs $ replace 'ugly' 'beautiful' . -r I can definitely see the value here

One of the approaches has been used by tens of thousands of users over decades and the other by a handful over a few months. I know which approach I would choose.

I'm sure many people who have had to put up with the atrocity of sed over decades would love this tool... the author obviously knows about sed and found it lacking.

Regardless, though, it's a tool she found useful, even if you personally don't. So what? The appropriate response is "Oh cool, I try to use sed. It has arcane syntax and portability issues, but it's a lowest common denominator that I can expect to find on all the systems I work on."

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#288
post #280
post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also not seeing the connection here. A few mean tweets over code quality vs threatening someone with life sentences over downloading documents is a very poor analogy on how we should be spending our time.

Both of you seem to think he said "instead." Consider the clauses rephrased: "Maybe we should start by examining our own community, before ..." Why? I'd guess because the blog post refers to celebrity hackers bullying another hacker. The community -- more than just these few guys -- can't even behave civilly. It's a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

Compare the cause-and-effect of both the situations. One can send someone to jail for life and destroy their finances, reputation etc... the other can hurt someones feelings.

Contending the latter should be addressed before (or even comparatively) to the former is what I take issue with.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#289
I hate to say this -- as an older person -- the only solution is to get a thicker skin, because people on occasion are going to be assholes to you. Even good people in a moment of snark. Even when they completely misunderstand what you did and that it is good. And worse, there are those who just tear down anything. It's just a fact of life. I suggest you read Feynman's "What do you care what other people think?" It helped me a lot.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#290

For years I have been terrified about putting my code on Github for fear of rage and retribution from the programmer community. This is a real problem for us amateur coders who enjoy hacking but don't necessarily have the chops to go head-to-head with the serious guys.

After participating in these comments tonight, I decided to purposely post some of the worst garbage I could find in my home directory. That way, I get to control the fact that yes, I have bad code. They can't act like it's a surprise.

http://rachelbythebay.com/w/2013/01/23/crap/

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