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How Doctors Die (2011)

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11–20 of 99 posts

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#11
post #4

we won't be able to repair these various cancers until we can do whole cell emulation on the offending cell and contrast/compare it to a healthy equivalent. We need to understand the mechanics of cells down to the molecular level. Then maybe we can think of a fix. At this stage in society, we know just enough about cancers to do more harm than good in the remaining years of life for the worst forms of cancer.

[deleted]

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#12
post #7

As a 26 year old American, my experiences with the US hospital system have been so abysmal that I would consider not even seeking treatment for many serious conditions unless I knew the solution would be straightforward. Abysmal in terms of having good medical outcomes, and being treated respectfully by hospital staff (who tend to be extremely overworked). Plus, it's degrading to have no control over how much you wil…

As Americans, we seem unable to realize that in many cases the best thing to do is nothing, or just keep an eye on it. We love the thought of "fighting cancer."

You can't just fix this problem at one level; it's pretty endemic. To start with, I'd love to be able to opt-out of unlikely-to-improve-my-outcome procedures, but even with those wishes doctors are likely to still act because of other pressures.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#13
post #4

we won't be able to repair these various cancers until we can do whole cell emulation on the offending cell and contrast/compare it to a healthy equivalent. We need to understand the mechanics of cells down to the molecular level. Then maybe we can think of a fix. At this stage in society, we know just enough about cancers to do more harm than good in the remaining years of life for the worst forms of cancer.

There are plausible ways to fix cancer, outlined in some detail, but they are so different from the present status quo of cancer research that the community does not pursue them. If it doesn't look a lot like a drug, good luck in obtaining funding for your research.

For example, WILT / OncoSENS. Which is to say turn off all mechanisms for telomere lengthening and work around the issues that will cause by replacing stem cell populations:

http://www.fightaging.org/archives/2011/10/accumulating-the-...

http://sens.org/research/introduction-to-sens-research/onco

---

Further, even a robust cure for a specific cancer based on targeted cell killing (by surface chemistry or other markers) doesn't require a complete understanding of the cancer cell - you just need to identify a reliable marker, no need to understand why it's a reliable marker.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#14

"someone breaking their ribs in an attempt to resuscitate them with CPR (that’s what happens if CPR is done right)" Is that always necessarily true...?

No, but in practice, pretty much.

There's new technology that automates this and the incident of rib-breakage is, as I understand, drastically minimized. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AutoPulse)

As an anecdote, my 70+ year old dentist (i.e. not the demographic with the strongest bones) had a heart attack (clinically dead). The responding EMTs used the AutoPulse, which saved his life. It pumped his heart for 10+ minutes while 1 EMT gave him air and the other drove to the hospital. No brain damage, no broken ribs.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#15
post #7

As a 26 year old American, my experiences with the US hospital system have been so abysmal that I would consider not even seeking treatment for many serious conditions unless I knew the solution would be straightforward. Abysmal in terms of having good medical outcomes, and being treated respectfully by hospital staff (who tend to be extremely overworked). Plus, it's degrading to have no control over how much you wil…

I wonder how much stress over money affects the health of patients. It's just the last thing you want to worry about when your body is failing.

I also think the system puts too much stress on relatives and the patient when it comes to choices and bureaucracy. Coming from Sweden, just having to choose between 7-8 different insurance plans is headache enough, but to have to choose your doctor, your hospital etc is just too much. I don't want to have to think about it. Americans seem to value choice and being able to shop around much more highly than I do. "Being a good consumer". I can intellectually understand why, but making choices all the time for everything is very taxing and energy consuming, and at some point I just want to be taken care of.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#16
post #7

As a 26 year old American, my experiences with the US hospital system have been so abysmal that I would consider not even seeking treatment for many serious conditions unless I knew the solution would be straightforward. Abysmal in terms of having good medical outcomes, and being treated respectfully by hospital staff (who tend to be extremely overworked). Plus, it's degrading to have no control over how much you wil…

I agree, and it's not just end of life treatment. I often tell people, half joking but half serious, that I would rather die than go to the hospital.

Even the simplest visit is an excruciatingly long, bureaucratic, kafkaesque nightmare where your bank account is drained, and the patient has little if any input or control over how they're treated. Hospitals just suck.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#17
post #2

HN Commentary from 2011: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3313570

The OP posted on that thread, so he knew this was a repost. Interesting article, but i fear for HN if reposting an old and interesting link you remember becomes a way of getting easy karma.

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#18
post #4

we won't be able to repair these various cancers until we can do whole cell emulation on the offending cell and contrast/compare it to a healthy equivalent. We need to understand the mechanics of cells down to the molecular level. Then maybe we can think of a fix. At this stage in society, we know just enough about cancers to do more harm than good in the remaining years of life for the worst forms of cancer.

We won't* fully correctly emulate a single human cell using deterministic computers in any reasonable timeframe. Even if we had a fully characterized model of a healthy cell, what mechanism would we then use to prevent/eliminate cancers? You still have to get something in there in order to kill the cancerous tissue, whether it's drug-based, mechanical, or radioactive. Claiming that attempting prevention/treatment is futile until a probably-not-in-our-lifetime goal is achieved is defeatist at the highest level.

*: Before responding, read the still-highly-relevant: http://www.andersonlocalization.com/pdf/more_is_different.pd...

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#19
post #7

As a 26 year old American, my experiences with the US hospital system have been so abysmal that I would consider not even seeking treatment for many serious conditions unless I knew the solution would be straightforward. Abysmal in terms of having good medical outcomes, and being treated respectfully by hospital staff (who tend to be extremely overworked). Plus, it's degrading to have no control over how much you wil…

As Americans, we seem unable to realize that in many cases the best thing to do is nothing, or just keep an eye on it. We love the thought of "fighting cancer." You can't just fix this problem at one level; it's pretty endemic. To start with, I'd love to be able to opt-out of unlikely-to-improve-my-outcome procedures, but even with those wishes doctors are likely to still act because of other pressures.

You can make your wishes explicitly known, it's called 'advanced directives' however most people either don't know about this or don't want to have to think about it because it involves facing their own mortality.

IF you really don't want CPR, or heroic measures to be taken on you, then get a DO NOT RECUSSITATE' or DNR tattoo on your chest or side, where the defib pads go (just in case) and carry around a copy of your advanced directives in your wallet.

For everything else, you will be conscious and thus have the ability to tell someone 'no'

Re: How Doctors Die (2011)

#20
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As Americans, we seem unable to realize that in many cases the best thing to do is nothing, or just keep an eye on it. We love the thought of "fighting cancer." You can't just fix this problem at one level; it's pretty endemic. To start with, I'd love to be able to opt-out of unlikely-to-improve-my-outcome procedures, but even with those wishes doctors are likely to still act because of other pressures.

You can make your wishes explicitly known, it's called 'advanced directives' however most people either don't know about this or don't want to have to think about it because it involves facing their own mortality. IF you really don't want CPR, or heroic measures to be taken on you, then get a DO NOT RECUSSITATE' or DNR tattoo on your chest or side, where the defib pads go (just in case) and carry around a copy of you…

The previous HN thread claimed that it's better to have a bracelet or necklace or similar than a tattoo, and in particular that tattoos may not actually be followed as consistently as bracelets etc.

I'm not interested in the debate as to why this is, just trying to inform people.

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