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What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

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Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#31
post #20

What's news here? We already knew how much Steve Jobs loved to design products.

The news is that there wasn't some "reality distortion field" cliche or temper tantrum. It's an account of Steve Jobs that you rarely read: sitting down with a team and iteratively designing products.

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure that at that time I had tons of music (using winamp) and photos on my computer (scanning was the way at that time).

You must've been somewhere nice that had fast internet. I think most people back then had dialup, and downloading a single song would take at least 20 minutes on their 28.8k modem.

You just queue up a bunch of stuff using a download manager[1] and stay connected for longer. Come back the next day (or two or three) and voila! The good managers would even resume partial downloads if the connection dropped (which it always did).

[1] - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Getright

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#33
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've only worked at small (<100 employees) companies, so I guess I've just never run into this. It's a little sad to think that you could work alongside someone and have to consider them a threat rather than an ally.

You should look back through the history of http://minimsft.blogspot.com Microsoft is worse than most because its ranking system actually encourages you to compete within your team not just outside.

In theory that is false, in practice it is less clear (at least to me). The ranking (and subsequent curve fitting known formally as calibration) is done across a level-band (bascially 'job title') across a much wider scope than a single team (i.e. across a division). The idea that your co-workers are actively plotting to somehow take some reward from you come review time is a poor caricature of reality. Does it happen? Possibly, Microsoft is a huge company. Is it common? Not based on my experience and conversations with others in different parts of the company. Anecdotally I have heard 0 credible stories about it from anyone willing to put their name behind it (i.e. I have seen anonoymous posts on minimicrosoft, but more on that in the next sentence). Also minimicrosoft has a clear selection bias as people don't go their to chat about how much they love various aspects of Microsoft culture. Citing that as evidence is like citing a Tobacco company research paper on the effects of smoking, questions on impartiality have to be considered. That said, and as I pointed out in my first sentence, I have no insight into the actual going-ons in stack-ranking meetings, so for all I know it could be horse-trading and petty-politics and curve-fitting on a per-team basis. That would be immensely stupid, and I don't get the impression that accurately models reality, though what the exact granularity between team of 10 and division of a thousand is, I don't know. There are other things about the Microsoft review system to dislike before curve-fitting, but it is certainly up there, and probably the most publically known aspect.

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#34
post #19

Did I miss something here...? "In 1991, I started work at NeXT, as Product Manager for Interpersonal Computing. It was the internet, before there was much of an internet. We called it Interpersonal Computing, but nobody paid attention until 5 years later when the WWW was born." The web existed in 1991, and Mosaic was launched in 1993. I first saw it in 1993, and it was a pretty big deal at the time. Have I misunderst…

1996 wasn't when the Web was born, but it is a lot closer to the point in time when the Web and the Internet went mainstream. IIRC 1994 is often given as that year, and even by 1995 it (famously http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Road_Ahead_(Bill_Gates_book... ) wasn't obvious to everyone that they were now at the centre of computing.

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#35
post #5

Between this and the Safari story, I'm struck at just how deep Apple's internal secrecy ethos runs. The idea that there is that level of dedication to keeping a project hidden, not just from outsiders, but from almost the entire rest of the company just blows my mind. It certainly explains how they're able to keep projects secret for as long as they do.

>but from almost the entire rest of the company just blows my mind. I've worked at Apple before and it wasn't that different to every other large corporation. Excluding obviously the hardware design and critical features. But everything else was par for the course. EVERY large company has politics and empire building. Especially when you are a multinational and have a driven workforce.

I'd speculate that it's less about politics and empires, and more about not getting too many cooks in the kitchen. It's easy to blur the vision for your product when you have opinions coming in from five thousand people, never mind having the entire world speculate and discuss the product that doesn't yet exist.

Think back to May 2007. Remember some of the iPhone mockups people were throwing around? Aside from being largely impractical and stupid, there was clearly no "right" way to do it that was obvious to everyone, as the mocks were so incredibly varied. At some point, you have to make a bet on what the best way to proceed is and go with it, or else you'll spend all day debating and not actually get anything done. That's far easier in small, "secretive" groups.

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#36
post #27
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you should have said, "Apple is people working hard, iterating and delivering." Many of those hard working folks are still at Apple. If Jobs was Apple, there should still be some skunkworks projects left behind to ship and the numbers are still favorable to Apple.

Yes, but as the OP describes, the process involved much iteration and constant feedback and energy from Jobs, not just a memo of what he wanted to see on launch day

I think the point was that Jobs was working with the teams as a contributor more than a dictator. It very specifically pointed out that Jobs' ideas were decoupled from his role as CEO (as were everyone else's) so there were just lots of ideas, and the best ones stayed around while the rest were thrown out.

Perhaps Jobs started that process, but I'm sure it still exists with him gone.

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure that at that time I had tons of music (using winamp) and photos on my computer (scanning was the way at that time).

You must've been somewhere nice that had fast internet. I think most people back then had dialup, and downloading a single song would take at least 20 minutes on their 28.8k modem.

As mech4bg said, much or most of people's .mp3 libraries at that point had probably come straight off CD. Napster wasn't even released until 1999, and "Rip. Mix. Burn." was Apple's edgy new slogan of 2001 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ECN4ZE9-Mo .

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should look back through the history of http://minimsft.blogspot.com Microsoft is worse than most because its ranking system actually encourages you to compete within your team not just outside.

In theory that is false, in practice it is less clear (at least to me). The ranking (and subsequent curve fitting known formally as calibration) is done across a level-band (bascially 'job title') across a much wider scope than a single team (i.e. across a division). The idea that your co-workers are actively plotting to somehow take some reward from you come review time is a poor caricature of reality. Does it happe…

This is impossible to read. Please restructure it in some way that involves paragraphs, fewer parenthesis and doesn't reference it's own sentences.

Re: What it's Really Like Working with Steve Jobs

#39
post #34
post #19

Did I miss something here...? "In 1991, I started work at NeXT, as Product Manager for Interpersonal Computing. It was the internet, before there was much of an internet. We called it Interpersonal Computing, but nobody paid attention until 5 years later when the WWW was born." The web existed in 1991, and Mosaic was launched in 1993. I first saw it in 1993, and it was a pretty big deal at the time. Have I misunderst…

1996 wasn't when the Web was born, but it is a lot closer to the point in time when the Web and the Internet went mainstream. IIRC 1994 is often given as that year, and even by 1995 it (famously http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Road_Ahead_(Bill_Gates_book... ) wasn't obvious to everyone that they were now at the centre of computing.

Yeah. 1994 is when I started seeing Zen and the Art of the Internet on the endcaps at Crown Books. Late 1995-1996 is when I started seeing books about the web given the same prominence.
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