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California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

xconomy.com

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Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#191

Post by [deleted] »

jmtulloss wrote: post #99
lisper wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> applicability only to criminal cases Where do you get that? The Constitution says simply: "No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed." Period, end of story. Just because someone on the Internet says this applies only to criminal law doesn't make it so.

See Calder v. Bull (1798). Unfortunately our law is not only the constitution, but also hundreds of years of decisions surrounding it. Makes it hard for any layperson to actually know what the law is!

[deleted]

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#192

Post by SilasX »

techsupporter wrote: post #136
bjcy wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Texas isn't too shabby either. Plus, fewer natural disasters means less downtime.

Hopefully you aren't fond of electricity[0], water[1], schools[2], or roads[3]. 0 - http://www.ercot.com/news/press_releases/show/26375 1 - http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/DM_south.htm 2 - http://www.statesman.com/news/news/state-budgets-call-for-cu... 3 - http://www.statesman.com/news/news/state-regional-govt-polit... (Texas is my home state. I left, though I keep close ties to it through family and frequent visits.)

Also left Texas for the Bay, but ... I just got off the phone with my parents, and they assure me Texas still has electricity, water, [public] schools, and roads.

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#193

Post by jacoblyles »

jey wrote: post #110

Can we just hurry up and address the real problem: California's constitution? We should just burn that flawed thing and start over. As I understand it, one of the major problems with California is that the reasonable-sounding idea that citizens should be allowed to amend the constitution through a ballot proposition has backfired and led to all sorts of special interests amending the constitution to protect their own…

You are still going to have the unions dominating the legislature and the cocomitant crushing pension obligations if you remove direct democracy from California.

The state is too big. You need too big of a budget to campaign here. So the unions dominate.

I say split the state in half.

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#194

Post by Niten »

pc86 wrote: post #79
rayiner wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, I think you'll see more of these problems as states get crushed under their existing debt and new expenditures from pension obligations, etc. See: http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/compare_state_spending_2...

Perhaps defined-benefit retirement plans should not be in the public sector since they haven't been in the vast majority of the private sector for quite some time.

It completely baffles me how any reasonable person could look at the retirement and health benefits situation in our country and come to the conclusion that our problem is being too generous to the working class.

Yes, the private sector has been much more effective than the public sector in collectively diminishing workers' wages and benefits in recent years. The logical conclusion is not that the public sector should do more to keep up with the downward spiral.

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#195

Post by [deleted] »

jacoblyles wrote: post #120
jibjaba wrote: post #61

To me this is a symptom of the twisted politics around taxation in the US. You have one very powerful group that is continually fighting to lower or eliminate taxes and another somewhat less powerful group that wants to bring in enough tax money to fund government services. One side cuts taxes or refuses to raise them and the other side finds new things to tax or other taxes to raise. Normally such a tug of war is no…

In California, our money goes to retired union worker's pensions, not current public services. Our most powerful lobbying group by money spent is the state teacher's union, followed by the state and municipal employee worker union. We have the highest taxes in the nation, poor public services, and massive debt. Pro-tax types should stop carrying water for bad governance. I am one of those anti-tax people you say "has…

[deleted]

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#196

Post by w1ntermute »

koenigdavidmj wrote: post #185
w1ntermute wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Under Bloomberg, NYC has turned from a police state into a full-fledged nanny state.

Unless you have certain melanin levels, in which case it is still a police state too.

Oh, it's still a police state as well, no doubt. It has probably gotten worse under Bloomberg.

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#198

Post by anigbrowl »

jey wrote: post #110

Can we just hurry up and address the real problem: California's constitution? We should just burn that flawed thing and start over. As I understand it, one of the major problems with California is that the reasonable-sounding idea that citizens should be allowed to amend the constitution through a ballot proposition has backfired and led to all sorts of special interests amending the constitution to protect their own…

I agree there are problems with California's cosntitution, but the actual issue here is that the QSB exclusion violated the US constitution.

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#199

Post by larrydag »

natrius wrote: post #166
techsupporter wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully you aren't fond of electricity[0], water[1], schools[2], or roads[3]. 0 - http://www.ercot.com/news/press_releases/show/26375 1 - http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/DM_south.htm 2 - http://www.statesman.com/news/news/state-budgets-call-for-cu... 3 - http://www.statesman.com/news/news/state-regional-govt-polit... (Texas is my home state. I left, though I keep close ties to it through family and frequent visits.)

Electricity is being worked on, as that press release indicates. On the hottest day or two of the year, the power might go out for a little bit. It's not a big deal. Water is going to be the biggest issue this legislative session. California has similar water problems. Schools... are complicated. That one might not get fixed, but performance is better correlated with household income than education spending. Roads ar…

Also looking at the Texas startup scene to name a few. TechWildcatters http://techwildcatters.com/ Texas Entrepreneur Network http://texasenetworks.com/ BarCamp Dallas http://barcamp.org/w/page/400642/BarCampDallas

Re: California To Hit Startup Founders with Big Retroactive Tax Bills

#200

Post by sp332 »

bjornsing wrote: post #52
basseq wrote: post #34

I did a quick google and found a discussion of retroactive tax laws (applying to gift taxes in 2010): http://www.assetprotectionsociety.org/the-likelihood-and-enf... Potential arguments include due process, "wholly new tax", lack of notice, ex post facto (with the same caveat as mentioned here about applicability only to criminal cases), and the fifth amendment taking clause. Conclusion: it's hard to fight.

Some things about the US still surprise me. In "socialist Sweden" (as it's sometimes called) retroactive taxation is unconstitutional. On the other hand capital gains is 20-30%, and most entrepreneurs actually have their gains taxed as income. That means you're lucky if you get to keep 13%. ;) I'm exaggerating a bit, but not much.

It's not retroactive taxation. The Supreme Court pointed out that a tax break enacted several years ago was unconstitutional.
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