Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

rememberaaronsw.tumblr.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 149 posts

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#81

Post by ghshephard »

danielweber wrote: post #78
ghshephard wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You transposed my text a bit. The "wrong" reference was to me webscraping journals via curl. I realize that sneaking into Wiring Closets and plugging in a laptop to get onto a privileged vlan isn't something sanctioned by the school. If I was caught, I probably would expect to get my hand slapped if I'm a student, and if I'm not a member of the community maybe even charged with trespass (though, I understand at MIT t…

Please read the indictment. It wasn't like he walked in on Monday to do this and they called the police on Tuesday. They were repeatedly trying to keep him out, and he knew it, and he kept on trying to get back in anyway. This went on for months . When they finally had a piece of physical evidence they called the Secret Service because they could get the guy. And he fled when campus police approached him.

I've read through the case - I understand what happened.

It's just that everything that was described was the type of thing that my university had to deal with all of the time. People were always spoofing MAC addresses, trying to get onto privileged VLANs, and the Campus IT was always playing Cat and Mouse with them, and, in a very, very few rare circumstances where the student did something really stupid, brought Campus Police into the conversation.

But Campus police was the absolute escalation - I don't ever recall my university calling in the RCMP (Canadian Federal Police, and municipal as well) to investigate someone doing the equivalent of what Aaron had done.

I absolutely agree with Aaron's parents. MIT and the Prosecutor over-reacted, and, when the truth of the matter surfaced, failed to course correct.

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#82

Post by biot »

igravious wrote: post #36

I don't think that I've ever seen anything like this (the sheer number of submissions related to one event) on HN before. I, like most others, follow the tussle between those who desire a world where the barrier to access information is lower and those who want to copyright, lock up and monetize all the information that we generate. Most of the time I feel that it is like a high tech soap opera but this events brings…

I am only vaguely familiar with Aaron Swartz, so the magnitude of the response on this site surprised me and reminds me of the HN front page when Steve Jobs died: http://www.waybackletter.com/archive/20111005.html

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#83

Post by danielweber »

waterlesscloud wrote: post #80
danielweber wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please read the indictment. It wasn't like he walked in on Monday to do this and they called the police on Tuesday. They were repeatedly trying to keep him out, and he knew it, and he kept on trying to get back in anyway. This went on for months . When they finally had a piece of physical evidence they called the Secret Service because they could get the guy. And he fled when campus police approached him.

They made a choice to involve the feds. This could very easily have been handled internally, and the result would have been effective from their viewpoint. Catch him using the same methods and give him a stern talking to from campus police, then not press charges. Pretty much what happened to people bending and even openly breaking the rules on campuses around the world for decades, if not centuries. But someone at M…

They made a choice to involve the feds.

Yes, because someone -- they did not know who, but someone -- kept on breaking into their network. Over and over and over and over.

handled internally

He wasn't a student.

the result would have been effective from their viewpoint

They kept on telling him "no" and he kept on going in anyway. It seems you think the 13th time they told him "no" he would have stopped, when he ignored the first 12 times.

By the time you get to the police chasing someone through the halls, you have passed the point where you can expect to get away with "a stern talking to." (I shouldn't have to say it, but I will anyway: that doesn't mean that a Federal prosecution for decades in prison is the proper response, either.)

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#84

Post by sandGorgon »

tobiasu wrote: post #53
rdl wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Realistically, he could have just gone ~anywhere outside the US and probably wouldn't have been pursued too aggressively.

Are we talking about the same US that tried to extradite Richard O'Dwyer over some copyright bs or nutcase Gary McKinnon? Both of them are not even US citizens, it only gets worse when you "belong" to the country that wants to put you on trial. There are few countries that are not in bed with the US. Usually they don't feel like getting into even more diplomatic difficulties unless there is some gain for them. Assang…

India would have been one possibility. We have hosted the Dalai Lama long enough.... and I would say ever since the U. S. started denying extradition of the 26/11 suspects, they wouldn't have had a lot of friends in the establishment here.

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#86

Post by rbanffy »

duaneb wrote: post #34
wololo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What changed?

He's being hyperbolic; MIT is still a very friendly hacker school. Aaron DID break the law, and I would not expect ANY school to stand behind him when he blatantly violated the law. It's pretty simple: don't break the law, much less using MIT resources to do so. That said, they could have handled it with a lot more finesse, especially when it is such horrible publicity for them. I suspect this has more to do with eag…

> MIT is an academic organization and is committed to, well, academics, not politics

Politics is too important to be left to politicians. If you refuse to take control over your environment, you cannot expect it to remain friendly to you, for you are no longer a force shaping it. Academics is politics.

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#87

Post by FireBeyond »

rdl wrote: post #50
bguthrie wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For what it's worth, if you're looking for another place to put your money, Aaron appreciated the work that Givewell (givewell.org) is doing. It's worth investigating how you can support them and the charities they endorse.

Hopefully there's a successful civil suit against the Institute, with funds going to Givewell.

On what grounds? That they reported a crime, that lead to an overzealous prosecution even after JSTOR said they had no interest in pressing charges, that may or may not have been the reason, or a reason, someone took their life.

People here and in other friends are discussing what they consider a blatant misuse of the law. To my mind, attempting to sue MIT for responsibility in Swartz's death would be a similar misuse.

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#88

Post by Evbn »

rdl wrote: post #50
bguthrie wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For what it's worth, if you're looking for another place to put your money, Aaron appreciated the work that Givewell (givewell.org) is doing. It's worth investigating how you can support them and the charities they endorse.

Hopefully there's a successful civil suit against the Institute, with funds going to Givewell.

What is MIT's tort? Investigating a repeat hacker violating physical building and network security?

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#89

Post by sadfasdf »

rogerthis wrote: post #47

Being a chronic depressed and chronic pain sufferer, I wonder how much problems like these contributed to him killing himself. I think about killing myself everyday. I haven't done it yet because I am a devout Catholic and I believe I can be in a worst place (or better) after death.

Very sorry to hear this. I understand how being in pain all the time can drive one mad. Try to find some help or some relief. Don't give up.

Re: Official Statement from the family and partner of Aaron Swartz

#90

Post by Evbn »

seiji wrote: post #9
jlgreco wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You aren't going to control any institution after you are dead. The best you can do is pick one that you feel you can trust.

Okay, poorly worded on my part. I was thinking more in line with Gates leaving everything to the Gates Foundation. My brain can't reconcile why someone would want to donate to something that already takes money from people in return for services. Kinda like the onion half-headline: "Man Has Alarming Level Of Pride In Institution That Left Him $50,000 In Debt."

Go dedicate a year to read about a small fraction of MIT's contributions to the world, and then post an update to your comment. We aren't talking about ITT or U of Phoenix here.
Post reply on HN