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Betrayed by LinkedIn

developer.linkedin.com

51–60 of 64 posts

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#51
post #7

A business model based 100% on a 3rd party social graph API is not a business model. I hope they can pivot the work they've done to something more standalone.

I'm also a bit perplexed how a business model based 100% on a 3rd party social graph discovers in January, when preparing for launch, that they were adversely affected by an API change apparently made in August.

It also sounds like a change LinkedIn were considering for a while that might have been avoided by sending an email stating "We're planning on building an app dependent upon the the X API call to do Y. Could you please let us know of any changes planned to this feature." If my business model was that tightly coupled to LinkedIn's API and nobody got back to me I'd take that as a warning sign.

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#52
post #14
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think this? It's certainly riskier but there have been many successful companies that start out relying heavily on a 3rd party APIs.

If you rely on a 3rd party for your business, then the 3rd party is in control of your company future. In that regard, its not about risk. Yes, using 3rd party API for your business model is risky, but thats a secondary effect. The major issue is than the future of the company, and any promises and investments done is completely dependent on that third-partys' whims. To some degree, your even in less control than if…

It's not the fact that you are using 3rd party APIs. There are plenty of legacy companies that created products based on 3rd party APIs from Microsoft, Oracle, Sun, etc, that did perfectly fine. Microsoft in particular is extremely professional and will bend over backwards to ensure backwards compatibility. You can still install many 20-year old programs on Windows 7 and they will run perfectly.

As I mention in my post, the issue is that these Web 2.0 companies don't offer support contracts, and don't have a formalized API that guarantee backwards compatibility. THAT is the problem. We ALWAYS bought a support contract whenever we integrated with an API. The support contract gave us some legal rights, but these days there are no such legal rights, and that is what is really risky.

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#53
post #40

Suppose I owned a shoe store and the only supplier I chose to work with was Nike. I built my store on top of Nike's product, became an expert at it, had lots of customers and knew the market well. One day, Nike sees how many orders I've been making lately and decides to cut off my supply and open a Nike Store in my town. No contract with Nike, I'm SOL. I start wishing I had diversified my supply a little more. In tra…

This.

And it doesn't necessarily have to be a "bad will" from the power supplier.

I know a store who went down because they were relying on a unique supplier and, at one point, the supplier experienced an issue at their factory, outside of their control (a flood).

The supplier was big and strong enough to deal with the momentarily slowdown (it lasted months) but the store I knew simply couldn't handle their customers' orders and couldn't accept new customers. It quickly degenerated: unable to pay the salaries, then unable to pay the bills, the tax, etc.

And the store, after years of "faithful" services, went bankrupt after a few weeks/months. The sad thing is you could see them trying desperately to stay alive and they were nice people.

So it's as you said: be careful to not depend on a power supplier because several things may go wrong.

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#54
post #41
post #13

I get this drupal error. -- PDOException: SQLSTATE[40001]: Serialization failure: 1213 Deadlock found when trying to get lock; try restarting transaction: DELETE FROM {semaphore} WHERE (name = :db_condition_placeholder_0) AND (value = :db_condition_placeholder_1) AND (expire variable_init [:db_condition_placeholder_1] => 112720946350f00b3f105ad8.99608950 [:db_condition_placeholder_2] => 1357908800.0644 ) in lock_may_…

Offtopic, but drupal stores locks in a DB? That looks highly inefficient.

Because it's available everywhere, including shared hosting. IIRC it can be reconfigured to other storage mechanism

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#55
post #49
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the other is trying to use me for something Giving/finding you a job?

But at what cost? I get a job today, fine. But then the company that found me the job is pressured to monetize better. Then what do they do? To whom do they sell my data or something based on my data in a way that I do not necessarily approve of? I generally don't like things tied in to my social networks. This is not because I don't think they are useful, it is because I don't have long-term trust in the companies d…

Thinking like this and having a profile in LinkedIn seem incompatible, for several reasons. In any case, by closing API access LinkedIn is not making nefarious use of your data impossible, only a bit harder. In fact, it's almost guaranteed that most 3rd party use of your profile data will be nefarious now, since they have to violate the ToS to get it in the first place.

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#57
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "tale" of many of the big startups you mentioned is that they still can't figure out how to effectively monetize their platforms. For instance, if you look at Twitter, they made a huge push to get the developer ecosystem to fill in holes Twitter itself couldn't cover; the end result being a growing community and revenue streams Twitter got nothing from. Seeing this, I think Twitter came to the belief they needed…

I don't understand why the likes of Twitter can't simply have set prices, ala AWS: X token activations + Y requests = $ Zk p/month developers have to pay. Clear, easy, fair, progressive. Surely there's a way to keep everyone in business.

I started writing a reply and realized your question was harder than it first looked when it comes to companies like Twitter versus a service like AWS.

Short Answer: AWS provides a agnostic service focused on utilization with no specific purposes in mind, hence a metered system makes perfect sense. Twitter only exists with user driven content and needs a constant pipeline of the stuff to survive, and because the web application is free in order to eliminate barrier to entry, implementing a metered system for developers would remove incentives to build new applications because they're having to pay to compete with something people can get for free.

Long Answer: You can easily explain why a metered system works for a company like AWS because you're renting a agnostic hardware platform you can do anything on from building the next Twitter to serving cat videos to grandmom's mobile device. In this case, they can consider all usage and bits equal and charge accordingly. It gets murkier when you look at companies like Twitter or Facebook that are trying to be content companies and global platforms at the same time. These kinds of companies make money by getting users to post content to their service, letting them sell targeted ads, compiling user profiles they can sell / reuse, and by selling content to third-parties who can analyze (i.e. Salesforce purchasing access to the entire Twitter firehose). Subsequently, most consumer oriented development on these platforms focuses on the posting and accessing of content and, in many cases, consists of standalone applications ranging from open source to paid for with a couple SaSS platforms thrown in for good measure. Monetizing this ecosystem poses two separate challenges. First, the external applications hide user data from the content company. Coming through an application, the app can send the bare minimum necessary for an HTTPS connection to the API and the company won't know if the user's on a mobile device or computer, what O/S and version they're running, the actual time of the interaction (for instance, sending a delayed tweet) and a whole host of other user metrics. This decrease in information hurts Twitter's ability to build user profiles and vector the user to things they might pay for. By tightening their grip on the third-party ecosystem, Twitter ensures the flow of information necessary to keep building these profiles.

Secondly, creating a metered usage system for a content company would flip the revenue system, developers would be subsidizing users using the content platform unless they send users a monthly bill for their usage of the app. This would completely destroy any third-party ecosystem since the web app is free. Why pay a monthly bill to use a otherwise free service? Sure, you might see some adoption, but I would argue it'd be microscopic compared to an ecosystem built on a free API.

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#58
It is not the first time "betrayed" and "LinkedIn" were used in the posting on HackerNews: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4148915

When will people learn not to be completely dependent on a third-party, especially one like LinkedIn, whose API was always restrictive? If privacy was a concern for LinkedIn, why do partner companies (aka $$$) have a less restrictive API?

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#59

It's sort of ridiculous how little information you can get from LinkedIn via their API. Case in point, I don't think you can get Twitter handles from even first-tier connections any more. I made the appropriate API calls, waved my hands, and all I got were empty values. The docs do clearly state that you should be able to download every Twitter handle associated with an account, so WTH? It looks like they've revoked…

I wonder how much of this has to do with Twitter ending their partnership with LinkedIn last summer

Re: Betrayed by LinkedIn

#60
post #7

A business model based 100% on a 3rd party social graph API is not a business model. I hope they can pivot the work they've done to something more standalone.

Last time I checked Zynga was still spending money on acquiring users that belong to Facebook, on Facebook.
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